Loading...
Welcome to Anarcho-Punk.net community ! Please register or login to participate in the forums.   Ⓐ//Ⓔ

Shady Bakunin

Discussion in 'General political debates' started by nclpw, Jul 27, 2013.

  1. nclpw

    nclpwExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    577

    0

    5

    May 25, 2012
     
    Opinions other than "fascism didn't exist then so he wasn't a fascist!11"? I just sense a lot of hypocrisy when it comes to certain things, in certain people(not on the forum, no).
    He should not really be treated any differently than any hypocritical band or activist is, or? I really don't buy that "fascism didn't exist" argument because it still makes him an anti-semite.
     

  2. Bakica

    BakicaExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    951

    0

    0

    Feb 21, 2010
     
    I...don't get it. What's this thread about ?
     
  3. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    A rant about Bakunin? ;)

    [​IMG]
     
  4. nclpw

    nclpwExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    577

    0

    5

    May 25, 2012
     
    Haha, I'm talking about the anti-semitism. Sorry, should have made that clear :D
     
  5. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    Are you saying that Michael Bakunin was Anti-Semitic?? :ecouteurs:
     
  6. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


    5,438

    79

    621

    Nov 13, 2009
     United States
    Bakunin's anti-Semitism cannot be ignored or dismissed, however this does not mean that his writings and thoughts on Anarcho-Communism are invalid, as a whole anarchism has taken many people to contribute the good pieces of philosophy and theory and (most importantly in my humble opinion) ACTION! He very obviously had some really fucked up notions on race as well as did Proudhom. But he inspired people like Durruti to action and you can't say that his anti-semitism stained Durruti's actions can you?
     
  7. Bakica

    BakicaExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    951

    0

    0

    Feb 21, 2010
     

    There are some notes on him being anti-semitic. Same goes for Proudhom as Punkmar mentioned.

    Taken from wiki, Bakunin quoted :

     
  8. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    So if Michael Bakunin knocked on your door, would you let him in?
     
  9. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


    5,438

    79

    621

    Nov 13, 2009
     United States
    No cuz he'd be an anarcho-zombie :ecouteurs:
     
  10. nclpw

    nclpwExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    577

    0

    5

    May 25, 2012
     
    Sure, not invalid, but it still is weird to me that him being shady, lets just call it that, is by large ignored in the "scene", even though his anarchist readers are not necessarily anti-semittic. He was no Hitler, but it still gives a bad feeling.
     
  11. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    Why weird? He was Anti-Semitic.

    The guy is dead you know :ecouteurs:

    Some of the early male european anarchist were not all that horizontal, when we look back into their ideas and life, they were not gods, but flawed just like many of us still working out some of our shit out. But since you know about Bakunin now or did, you can point that out to those "Anarchx Scenester" you meet here and there...

    I wonder how many of the ideas Bakunin for one contributed to anarchism where his? and how many where actually happening or had happened in life and in communities and he was one of the first to write it down and theorize on it on paper...

    maybe some one like David Graeber, anthropologist/anarchist could write something on this here and realy get to some of the ideas of anarchism and where they originated from?? :ecouteurs:
     
  12. nclpw

    nclpwExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    577

    0

    5

    May 25, 2012
     
    Seemed like people would rather call him weird than anti-semitic, but you are absolutely right. I wonder if he might even have influenced the nazis, there was a study made of that but I have to find the sources before I start claiming shit like that.
    And I often wonder how many ideas were actually his too, but I guess we could try for ages to dig up reliable sources on this and still not really know for sure.

    That would be interesting! Maybe Chomsky will dig into that soon. :D
     
  13. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    here is an interesting article called "Anarchism and Taoism" some of the ideas are quite similar to anarchism and they did not originate in europe...

    http://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/ ... and-taoism

    :D
     
  14. nclpw

    nclpwExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    577

    0

    5

    May 25, 2012
     
    I atually recently read a book that mentiones that! It was a fictional novel though, but still. Thanks! I`ll have something to read tonight :D
     
  15. Kobac

    KobacExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    460

    4

    25

    Nov 7, 2009
     Croatia
    Anarchism is far more older idea than Bakunin, Proudhorn, Krompotkin, etc....These guys just realized and put it on the paper to spread that tought around.I love theirs stuff about anarchism, but this idea was borrowed, and they just added a little of the spirit of modern society.I was reading few years back about taoism and instantly noticed connection between these two philosophys(I would say one philosophy cause anarchism is radical taoism :lmao: )Kiddin`.

    Bakunin had issues about Jews and now that is history(at least he publicly said that, he did not hide his views).I appreciate Bakunin or any anarchist because of his ideas, his or theirs involvment in movement and deeds.
    Few can resist such old tradition as labeling.
     
  16. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    I would have to disagree, it was actually insurectionist taoism! Im all about post-left taoism now! :lmao:
     
  17. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    AAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH

    ill see you at the barricades...
     
  18. THEBLACKNOVA

    THEBLACKNOVAExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


    965

    0

    0

    Aug 11, 2011
     Mexico
    nclpw???

    im at some film screening some friends where a part of and it sucks :ecouteurs: ATTACK \m/
     
  19. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


    5,438

    79

    621

    Nov 13, 2009
     United States
    :lmao: Trolls gonna troll...
     
  20. fubarista

    fubaristaExperienced Member Experienced member


    129

    0

    0

    Nov 13, 2011
     
    Wait....I must have missed something. Is there something anti-Semitic in that paragraph?

    I have some friends on Twitter, born and raised in Israel, both professional translators, now living in Washington state, who left Judaism because of all the hatred and bigotry. Has everyone seen the recent statements by Israel's Chief Rabbi regarding kushim (that's the n-word in Hebrew)? You know Israel is deporting Black asylum seekers with total disregard for international law?

    Zionists got a state and now all the racism and intolerance that Jews had been trying to hide :ecouteurs: so as to gain sympathy, is on public display. Recently, David Sheen Tweeted passages of Talmudic hate that are stomach-turning. How many countries are left in the world that don't have a Rothschild owned central bank? Four? Cuba, North Korea, and Iran, I think, but there's probably another. And aren't all of them under attack or targeted for attack by the US and Israel?

    Here's a link to something my friends translated from Hebrew not too long ago:

    Holocaust Survivor's Daughter Will Defy Apartheid Israel to Save African Refugees http://fubarandgrill.org/node/1534

    Nice try, but remembering Rachel Corrie I don't think there's much chance of success. Judaism itself is founded on chosenness, that this bearded dude in the sky prefers males to females and Jews to everyone else. Jewish Holocaust survivors in Israel who have tried to rent rooms to Arab students or save Black immigrants from angry mobs, have met with death threats. I don't know how much tolerance of intolerance is required of liberals, but I don't think it is mandatory for anarchists.

    Not too long ago a Jewish settler in Israel got on a bus and shot four Palestinians dead. When the other Palestinian passengers (Israel has segregated bus lines) finally managed to kill him, they were prosecuted for terrorism. To avoid being prosecuted for terrorism, they'd have had to allow him to continue shooting them until everyone on the bus was dead. And the Israeli wouldn't have been punished.

    I'm Jewish by Nazi standards, because both my parents were Jewish, but I am not Jewish by religion. And I am openly anti-Semitic. I'm an atheist and I believe that if there was a God, which there isn't, She would not have chosen any one group over any other. Nor would she have given any one group the specific permission to rape the women and children of other groups. No omnipotent, omnicient mythical deity would be schizophrenic enough to say, "Thou shalt not kill," and then tell the Israelites that some of their neighbors are peaceful and unarmed but don't believe in Her, so they should go out and kill them and bring back their foreskins.

    They say nobody is more fanatical than recent converts to a religion, so maybe nobody is more anti-Semitic than people like me who were born into a racist, sexist religion and chose human rights instead. But I don't think Bakunin said anything anti-Semitic and zombie or not, I'd open my door for a chat. :ecouteurs:
     
Loading...
Similar Threads - Shady BakuninForumDate
Shady Record StoresMusic, punk scene & subculturesJul 23, 2010