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Why we can no longer support Amebix or anything related to Rob Miller

Discussion in 'Music, punk scene & subcultures' started by punkmar77, Feb 15, 2020.

  1. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Many of you that pay attention to these things, know what went down with Rob 'The Baron' Miller and Tau Cross last year, then again many of you never heard anything about it. A few years ago, I personally got into it with him during the Milo Yiannopoulos disturbances at the University of California Berkeley when he decided to attempt to defend Milo's right to 'free speech' and to vilify and criminalize my fellow Antifa. Well as any of you that might be familiar with me know, I wasn't having that shit. I could care less about Amebix worship, I did care greatly however about undocumented students of color having their lives threatened by thinly veiled white supremacists, and a fully grown caucasian male living on an Island in the UK making swords and pretending to live in the dark ages, thinking he had any kind of moral authority to speak up against them. It was a very public brawl and thankfully lots of punks witnessed it and had their first taste of what was to come 3 years later. It really bothers me when I see any of my friends rocking Amebix gear, what is the difference to wearing a Skrewdriver shirt or a Burzum shirt? To me, there is absolutely none, I'm not down with that tired ass cliché of separating the art from the artist. So now I think it is high time for us at anarcho-punk.net to sever ties with everything Amebix.

    An Open Letter to Rob Miller (Amebix, Tau Cross) | Features

     

  2. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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  3. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Also just for the fucking record: A Mr. Andy Lefton was made well aware of the initial very disturbing defense of white supremacists by Mr. Miller, in a private message to me, he politely asked me not to make a big deal about it in public because he was putting a new band together with Miller and he believed that Rob just made a one time mistake. Well like a jackass I let him pull at my heartstrings and honored his request at that time, a big fucking mistake on my behalf. When the shit hit the fan last year, Andy published a letter distancing himself from Miller and pleading innocence about his supposedly 'hidden' views. Absolute fucking bullshit. Later as I was randomly going over the whole great CRA$$ debacle here on APN, whose name appears prominently berating us and defending Steve Ignorant, Penny Rimbaud and Gee Voucher? That's right, fanboy Andy Lefton. Talk about wanting to kick myself in the ass.
     
  4. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Good job for finding this. I had never heard of this story. Definitely disgusting stuff. No excuse here.

    How did Amebix react to this as a band? Did they distance themselves from this guy?

    However, a lot of punk bands had members that didn't age well, so it all depends on how the other members of the band react to this.

    My opinion: if the band takes a stance against this bullshit from an ex-member then it's the right thing to do and they can't be blamed for somebody else's decisions. If they chose to close their eyes and live in denial, or just stay silent about this issue, then it's totally wrong and they are to blame too.

    Where can we see this statement? Just for context.

    It was wrong for the other band members to refuse to talk about the issue at first. But if they ended up making a clear statement then took the right decision to correct the shot, it's forgivable even if they made an error at first.

    I believe people deserve a second chance sometimes if they realize they made an error and change their attitude. Of course, this doesn't apply to Rob Miller who had multiple chances to retract his bullshit and change his attitude but instead chose to refute the accusations with bullshit excuses.



    Edit. I think I found the official statement from the band


    The last album should definitely be removed from this forum. Even the label dropped them so there's no reason to have downloads of an album that the label refused to release due to this story. I totally agree with this statement:
    However, I am not sure what to do with the previous Amebix albums as things were very different. The article says that the author influenced his views only "over the past few years".

    Personally I have never been a big fan of Amebix, but it's a cult band in the scene and very popular on this forum, so we should be cautious either way. I would like to have more opinions on this from other forum members.
     
  5. Red Menace

    Red MenaceActive Member Forum Member


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    Burzum was one person, and that person happens to be a murderer and a racist.

    A whole lot of people were in Amebix over the years, and only one of them is a Holocaust denier and he wasn't one back then.

    Even two or three of the original members of Skrewdriver, who were in the band before the Nazi stuff, completely distanced themselves from Skrewdriver once Skrewdriver started writing Nazi songs.

    I think each case should be judged on its own merits.

    Burzum, completely unacceptable. Amebix is ok, Rob Miller though is finished for me and I'm not listening if he does future music. Skrewdriver obviously is unacceptable, but I wouldn't condemn those guys who were in the band before the Nazi stuff and who were against all of that. That's just my way of looking at it though obviously.
     
  6. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    When I and Rob got into it a few years ago, Amebix was still active, Stig is also a friend of mine so I personally don't take the decision lightly, whether the rest of Skrewdriver distanced themselves or not, to me, is totally irrelevant. While Ian Stuart was still alive he continued to receive royalties for his 'non nazi' album, and he used that money to further his nazi agenda in any way he saw fit. Same goes for Burzum, same goes for Amebix. Either we are antifascist, or we are giving passes for fucking sentimentality.
     
  7. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Here is a private message I sent Andy Lefton (Tau Cross & War//Plague) on July 4th 2019 the same day he published his letter, it is marked as read, so he definitely read it, he just never replied.

     
  8. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    When he told me that Antifa of Color where the real criminals.. he never apologized, and like I said above Amebix were still together, as a matter of fact Alternative Tentacles was just about to re-release some of their music and their last record had just come out. I absolutely believe people deserve second chances, when they are remorseful and apologize, not when they double down and go holocaust denial and immigrant bash and promote videos called 'Fortress Europe' among other very questionable actions.
     
  9. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Skrewdriver came to my mind but I didn't want to use a Godwin point.

    Sure, the first album is not nazi stuff. But would we want to distribute a Skrewdriver album on anarcho-punk.net forum? Definitely not.

    Obviously apples and oranges here and we can't compare Amebix to Skrewdriver.

    I found another statement from an Amebix member. They seem honest in distancing themselves from the other dude.


    It would suck to trash the art of a band that 12 different people took part in, just for the actions of a single person, considering the other persons were not aware of the issue and denounced it as soon as they learn about it.

    upload_2020-2-16_1-3-55.png

    [​IMG]

    It's really a tough decision for the old albums, and there seem to be no precedent of a label dropping the old albums due to this story.


    Sorry if I was not clear - when I was talking about second chances I was talking about the other members of the band who made a statement to take a stance against the holocaust denial stuff.
    As for Rob Miller there's no excuse. He had a chance to apologize when the article was published, but instead, he doubled down and had no regret. Fuck this guy. But it seems like the other members were not aware because they didn't have close contact with Rob, according to their statements.
     
  10. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    I also apologize for the sake of clarity, I've never said those other members should be ostracized, however Stig is Rob's brother and he doesn't speak to him either. The thing is, it was always pretty much Robs band, Stig always maintained himself in the squatter punk scene and most of the cool shit Amebix was ever involved with was because of Stig, not Rob. To me, the art will forever be tarnished, like displaying an Adolph Hitler water color in your living room, because well, he wasn't a nazi when he created it. Promoting Amebix, and let's not kid ourselves, free Amebix downloads promotes Amebix, is promoting a band that affords Rob money. This is the real question, do we as an antifascist collective, want to continue to help this person, or not?
     
  11. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    Glad to see that you deleted all the Amebix download threads.
    Sad about the fact that some of them deny the Holocaust never happened, or that it's just one big conspiracy.

    My father's side of the family left Latvia as soon as the Nazi's goose stepped their way into their country. He and his family saw firsthand, the devastation, pain, and suffering they caused.

    I know for a fact that The Holocaust DID happen. IT'S REAL!
     
  12. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    We haven't yet, but I really think we should, it bothers me to no end that we continue to be associated with that person in any way. I have had 4 survivors as friends in my life, I will always stand up against authoritarians and supremacists of any stripe.
     
  13. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    What are the fucking odds? Rob Miller just posted today as Tau Cross. He thinks he can carry on and face no opposition? I think he is ripe for a milkshaking. Screenshot_20200216-134718_Facebook.jpg
     
  14. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    If the consensus opinion is to delete all of the albums, then let's do it. We can always change our mind if new information comes out.

    Fuck you, Rob, for selfishlessly ruining a cult band of the Anarcho-Punk scene. Very sad to see.
     
    punkmar77 likes this.
  15. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Thank you everyone, this is painful, but the right thing to do.
     
  16. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Ok all Amebix download links are gone, a sad day indeed. But the good news is, there are bands coming out with new material and new activism constantly, and just maybe Rob will react and capitulate down the road sometime, for the sake of his past bandmates and fans I really hope he does.
     
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