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Who we Are - Revision and Voting

Discussion in 'General political debates' started by antitude420, Jun 26, 2010.

Voter count: 9

Do you agree whit the current who we are text?

Poll closed Jul 31, 2010.
  1. Yes

    9 vote(s)
    100.0%
  2. No (please, specify and contribute to it's improvement)

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    As a response to the current disagreements and misunderstandings about the 'who we are' text and for the sake of flexibilty, I decided to create a topic were we could debate, revise and vote that. Also, it's an opportunity for new and old members equally, who joined the forum before actually taking the time to do the actual research about some of what is said on the text and that latter changed their minds, to express their feelings about it and for us, as a community, to decide what really unites us.

    As for me, I agree with all of it :)
     

  2. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    You didn't put a date on when it ends, also I don't think the points are up for debate really, but what do I know?
     
  3. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    seriously why fucking register here if you DO NOT agree with them? sounds stupid to me.
     
  4. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    I will, forgot about that. Though the topic doesn't need to end when to poll does, imo.

    I spoke to Ungov before I created this topic and he actually sugested as a way to know if people STILL agree with the points of unity and if they want to see them changed. The P.O.U aren't laws or rules, just points in common people should have for the sake of coerence and union in the forum. Also, as an anarchist community who, I think, believes in direct democracy, why shouldn't we debate about our points of union and give the new members an opportunity to do so?

    I agree with all the points, but that's me. I understand people should also agree with them before thinking about registering the forum but some new ideas wouldn't hurt would they? I think we should always be open to improvements...

    (and I guess this answers Anxiety's post also)
     
  5. Probe

    ProbeExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    Not everyone that registers here are radical anarchists so I think instead of banning someone who doesn't agree with the slightest thing we should just listen/think about to what he/she has to say, or politely correct him.

    Just my opinion, but other than that the Points of Unity are fair enough :)
     
  6. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    Yes. I think curiosity should be very much welcome in this forum and we could use it as 'weapon' of change maybe...
     
  7. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    What disagrements are you talking about ? There is none.

    Also like others said, there is no point of debating the point of unity. Maybe the rest of the text, but for the P.O.U. if you dont agree with them you have nothing to do here.

    This site is called ANARCHO-punk.net, it means this website is anarchist.

    Anarchism is anti-capitalism, anti-fascism, internationalism and anti-authoritarism. And that's exactly our 4 main point of unity


    The whole text is already accepted by the members, if you have a disagrement then suggest a modification to the text, tell us what should be modified. Right now this thread is useless.. Especially if you say you agree with all of the point of unity

    But oh well, let it run if you really want to...
     
  8. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    I'm not open to debate when it comes to any pro-racist, pro-sexist, or pro-capitalist free speech or hatespeech defense nor should any serious anarchist activist be open to changing those points, any watered down and homogenized 'anarchy' of this nature is something I don't want any part off.
     
  9. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    Yes, I do agree with all of them.

    But there have been disagreements about them (or the text), like anarco-capitalist registering and trying to debate their way out of banning. And I also remember all that fuzz about freedom of speech, Chomsky and even The Exploited which nearly got people banned...

    Maybe it's not the P.O.U, it's the text and I just put it all in the same bag. Maybe I should've specified...

    EDIT : Geez, people. Do you really think I want sexists, capitalists, nazis, negationists, racists, anti-semetics etc. dwelling in this forum?! I'm just proposing a damn debate and as was said above, maybe we should add that people who have doubts or are curious on the 'Anarchy' topic are welcome here.
     
  10. Probe

    ProbeExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    Yeah actually let me clear something up too, when I said:
    "someone who doesn't agree with the slightest thing"
    I didn't mean sexists/homophobes/nazis etc

    EDIT: is Homophobes the right word?
     
  11. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    So what you meant was a revision of the 'who are we' text, nest pas? You have to be more specific Antitude 420, when you put things to a vote that can change the way this forum is conducted.....just sayin', don't take it personally
     
  12. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    Me neither. I doubt anyone here is, so this useless vote will just be used to prove it.

    Already written in the text. Did you even read it?


    I'll repeat that this vote is useless, the text have already been accepted. we arent going to make a vote each month to know if members still accept the text. If you have something to change, make a proposal.
     
  13. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    Yes,that's what I wanted to say. And it's fine, I won't take it personally :)

    It's almost 4.15am where I live and I'm pretty damn tired. I'll change the topic before I go get some sleep though ;)
     
  14. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    Well, then it won't be useless. Wasn't that the point of this all? To know if people agreed or not?

    I already stated that I agree with the points of unity, is it really that hard to understand that I didn't make this topic for myself?
     
  15. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: Points of Unity - Revision and Voting

    We already know if people agreed. And yes it is useless.

    If someone disagree they just have to make a suggestion to change something. Since nobody made suggestion to change the text, it is obvious nobody has a problem with it.

    If others have something to say, they are old enough to make a topic by their own.

    Seriously... this is useless. It is already written in the "who are we" text that the members can start a vote to change something, the members don't need you to tell them they can change something if they don't agree..
     
  16. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    It's not a matter of me telling anything to anyone, it's a matter of organisation. If someone has a problem with something, they can come here and express that.
    And, also, it's a way for us to know if people who weren't registered and didn't had a chance to vote on the 'who we are' text, agree with it so we can stop pointless arguments.
     
  17. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    what is it exactly that you are expecting people here to say they have a problem with if even you don't have a problem with it?

    People always have the option to start their own forum and allow whatever trash to join it that they want.
     
  18. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    If people weren't here to vote on it at the time (like me) then they would have read this text and used it for a basis for deciding whether or not to join the forum (like me) and if they wanted to debate capitalism, racism, sexism, etc. they would not have registered (unlike me.)
     
  19. ghoul

    ghoulExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    The only thing I disagree with is that several of the points stifle discussion and discourse. To threaten banning people just for discussing the possible merits of aspects of capitalism is wrong. If you disagree instead give a counter argument, give examples, educate. If you truly believe your idea is correct there should be no fear of discussion of things that run counter to it.

    One of the points is anti-authoritarianism right? I looked it up on wikipedia and somethings stood out to me.

    "Authoritarianism is a form of social organization characterized by submission to authority. It is opposed to individualism and democracy."

    "No guarantee of civil liberties or tolerance for meaningful opposition"

    "No freedom to create a broad range of groups, organizations, and political parties to compete for power or question the decisions of rulers," with instead an "attempt to impose controls on virtually all elements of society"

    "control of internal opposition and dissent."

    Banning people for discussing things that you do not agree with is exactly this. I understand this site is to be used as an organizational tool, but to deny to people the ability to discuss the theory behind the ideas goes against the points as well.
     
  20. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    There's already a popular assembly forum for that. We don't need you or your topic for that.


    Fuck off ghoul, we have 4 points of unity and anti-capitalism is as important as anti-fascism. We are not goint to counter the fascists with arguments, same thing for capitalists. There are countless other forums to debate with capitalists or fascists, anarcho-punk.net is a TOOL FOR PEOPLE SHARING COMMON POINT OF UNITY, not a battleground to debate with them. Capitalists shouldnt even have registered here in the first place.


    Oh shut the fuck up damn troll, i'm really sick of your bullshit, you are doing exactly thr same thing NGNM85 was doing.

    It is not authoritarism, it is direct democracy. We have 4 other forums and it's exactly the way we work. We need a way to solve conflicts, we can't let the trolls keep ruining the forum for everyone if we want to go somewhere

    We will only ban people who break the point of unity, and if you break them you shouldnt have registered here in the first place since we ask everyone to read and accept the terms before registering.

    An anarchist society would function exactly the same way.


    Ok i'm wasting my time again, you have been explained that 432340923849032 times and you keep being a troll. Fuck you.
     
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