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Steve Ignorant

Discussion in 'Music, punk scene & subcultures' started by ungovernable, Oct 3, 2009.

  1. DZA

    DZAExperienced Member Experienced member


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    Jun 30, 2010
     
    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    From http://www.punknews.org/article/41744

    He is trying to make at least a bit of an effort to let people know it's not actually Crass. Make of it what you will though, I'm not defending or hating, just thought you'd be interested.
     
  2. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    IF he really wanted to make effort to let people know this is not crass, he would tell the businessmen he chosen as promoters to stop advertising it as crass, or else he will change promoters. He's the man behind the whole thing, he can have the control over everything if he really wants to...
     
  3. Unite&Resist36

    Unite&Resist36Member Forum Member


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    Mar 15, 2011
     
    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    Did any of the other Crass members "sellout"?
     
  4. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    Not as much as Steve. At first other members were against Steve doing gigs with crass songs and Pete highly critized him. I still have respect for other members even if they ended up to let Steve do his gigs.
     
  5. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    Crass is also sponsored by facebook. That's cool.

    [​IMG]

    Crass used to be a band that wanted to stay outside of the mainstream industry, a band that refused promoters and managers, a band that refused to play in big capitalist venues, etc.... And now, because of Steve Ignorant, crass is now sponsored on the biggest capitalist website on the planet.
    The problem is not that Crass is appearing on facebook (many anarchist bands and organizations have a facebook page), the problem is that because of Crass, facebook is being paid a lot of money for ads spots.

    That's what you get when you choose businessmen as promoters and capitalist venues where you play...
     
  6. hagarthewomb

    hagarthewombNew Member New Member


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    Apr 1, 2011
     
    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    If you have the wit, the issues of entry prices pale beside the issues dealt with in www.crassunofficial.com

    It's a CRASS performance as opposed to the current merchandising and exploitation going on.

    HAGAR
     
  7. Dan.

    Dan.New Member New Member


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    Apr 9, 2011
     
    The sound of free speech....? LOL! - Crass Censorship

    Hi, folks :)

    I recently posted a link to Pete Wright's 'Crass Unofficial' website http://www.crassunofficial.com/docs/crass_journal.pdf , on Southern's weblog page http://blog.southern.com/2010/08/the-fe ... #more-1013 , so as to give an opportunity for people to see the other side of events concerning the recent 'Crassical Collection' series of re-releases. It would appear that my post has since been deleted!

    "The Sound Of Free Speech" , eh....? LOL!
     
  8. vAsSiLy77

    vAsSiLy77Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Jun 21, 2010
     
    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL!

    fine dan. - but is this hint of stalinism necessary - this post-crass-farce has lost any resemblance to something that would make a matter of free speech - in other words: so what?
     
  9. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL!

    Good on ya Dan, just one more nail in the coffin that was Crass..hypocrite motherfuckers
     
  10. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL!

    When Anarcho-Punk.net was launched, i posted an announcement on Southern Records forum... The immediatly banned me and deleted my post. I made another account to complaint, they also banned me and removed my post again.

    Not surprising that they are now even censoring their ex-members.

    Fuck Steve Ignorant and fuck Crass.

    There's only idiots like Profane Existence to keep worshipping them (see the interview in their last edition of PE magazine)
     
  11. ChaosUK

    ChaosUKActive Member Forum Member


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    Apr 9, 2011
     
    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL!

    This shit is hurting me on the inside out man! i grew up with listing to Crass!
    I am torn on this subject :'(
     
  12. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL!

    Same...

    Thats probably why im so shocked
     
  13. Dan.

    Dan.New Member New Member


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    Apr 9, 2011
     
    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL!

    Hi. "So what?" I don't really understand your point, mate....? I would have thought that the irony was obvious: that free speech should involve a dialogue from both sides, and that censoring any comments that are contrary to the opinions of Penny Rimbaud & Southern, is grossly hypocritical, for those who consider themselves to be Anarchists. I think in doing so, Southern (possibly at the behest of Rimbaud & Vaucher...?), have shown themselves for what they truly are....., & it certainly validates a lot of what was said by Pete, Joy, & Andy, in the emails & letters featured in the 'Crassunofficial' link, with regard to Rimbaud's modus operandi .
    "But is this hint of Stalinism necessary?" - Well, yeah, obviously Southern seem to think so!
     
  14. vAsSiLy77

    vAsSiLy77Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL! - Crass Censorship

    yep, yours right - i didn't got your point right and promptly misinterpreted your post - sorrysorrysorry for this out-of-personal-frustration overreaction - i just can't take any new ripple of this mudslinging farce no more!
    again, sorry for my mistake on you!
     
  15. Dan.

    Dan.New Member New Member


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    Apr 9, 2011
     
    Re: The sound of free speech....? LOL! - Crass Censorship

    No worries, mate :)

    I share your frustrations about the recent debacle, concerning Crass. A lot of us grew up with them, & drew a lot of our (anti-)political influences from them: we were young, & impressionable, & we learnt a lot from them.......but, it's sad to say, that the more I learn about Mr Ratter, the more I see him for what he is: selfish, & egotistical, & not a true egalitarian. He took John Loder's side, with regard to Andy Palmer's exit from the band/collective, & thought it still made good (business) sense to regard Palmer no longer as an equal (due to being paid £5000 on leaving - 5 years after he put £5000 in to fund the 'Reality Asylum' 7" - so technically leaving with less than he initially put in...), & saw fit to not count him in as an equal member of the collective, when it came to sharing the collective's subsequent income.
    Pete tried to fight Andy's corner (sadly to no avail), & Eve agreed to share her income from the re-releases straight 50/50 with Andy - fair play to her :)

    PEACE! Onwards & upwards...
     
  16. DZA

    DZAExperienced Member Experienced member


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    Jun 30, 2010
     
  17. Mykill Von Doom

    Mykill Von DoomMember Forum Member


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    Apr 18, 2011
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    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    It was this thread which led me to this forum.
    Crass were the soundtrack to my early teens and it was quite painful to read the communications on crassunofficial & Southern forum.
    I think we tend towards those with similar views to ourselves, rather than being blatantly directly influenced by the lyrics of bands whose music we like; so I don't credit
    Crass (and other early anarcho bands) with forming my views, but they did provide a useful framework for fitting my views on various subjects into an overall worldview
    and helped create a social network for communicating with like-minded people.
    I never thought of Crass as heroes, rockstars or in any way better than me, and I never subscribed to the ridiculous more-PC-than-thou attitude of some in the anarcho scene.
    It seems like the members of Crass gave up a great deal of their individuality in order to be this single artistic/political unit, becoming subsumed into an entity which was more than the sum of its parts.
    It shouldn't come as any surprise that, years after the fact, the members have very fundamental objections to each other's handling of the Crass "legacy".
    All of us humans are fallible, have some degree of ego, and even close comrades will have slightly different outlooks.

    The point I'm interested in hearing your opinions on is, are you fundamentally opposed to the notion of Steve Ignorant touring Crass songs as a "celebration" of what the band used to mean (ignoring for now the manner in which he's done/doing it), and ditto for Penny's remastering/reissuing program. Is it a betrayal of what Crass meant? Are our opinions as valid as the ex-members?
    I don't object at all to the tour & reissues, in principle. But the crassunofficial correspondances seem to bely a total inability of the members to discuss their differences and agree on what the legacy of Crass is, and how it should be handled. Why shouldn't Steve have some fun singing the songs one last time, if his time in Crass was such an ideological straightjacket? Why shouldn't the music be available in a more up-to-date package?
    Penny seems to me to be demonstrating, not a money-grabbing attitude, but the same as any other artist in demanding "his share" of the rights to Crass material, despite their initial agreement that all art/music was attributed to all members equally. Maybe it's ego that wants to say "Penny Rimbaud wrote THESE lyrics and composed THIS music".

    It's no great revelation to point out that we all live in capitalist societies and have to acquire money to live, so what level of income is an artist allowed from his art to be fair or unexploitative? I can't object to Steve making some profit from his tour, but how much is too much? Enough to pay his band's expenses and a bit left over to live off? Expenses and NO more?
    I remember all day gigs in the 80s costing only a few quid for anything up to ten bands. I've been to gigs recently which were only around £4 for 3 or 4 bands - 1 of which was a foreign band on tour. At what point does it become unacceptable? I don't like to feel that a band is ripping me off, but I'm happy to pay enough for them to be able to continue what they're doing. I've never been in a band that toured much, and I've never made a penny from any of the go-nowhere bands I've been in - and not cared about that, because until I got ill, I always had a job. I'm not so arrogant to think that all bands should do as I do, make no money and give their recordings away for nothing.

    So, where do you draw the line, and are you so sure that you're right that you can say that all bands/artists should draw their line at the same point?
    If I've learned anything in my life, it's that compromise is essential to getting anything done in reality, and that all the lines we draw are fuzzy and not fixed absolutely.
    The older I get, the more I doubt.
     
  18. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Aug 21, 2009
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    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    Some updates...

    Steve ignorant sold OVER 1000 TICKETS for his show in Quebec. Not even counting the tickets that will be sold at entrance.

    1000 tickets @ 25$ each is 25,000 bucks of profit. or maybe just 24,000 since he will have to pay for the venue.

    He's doing 10-15 shows like this one, so calculate how much profit he will make......

    How can Crass fans possibly defend him after that ??? How can you even pretend it is justified to make that much money because "we live in a capitalist society and you have to survive"

    Seriously thats not what crass is supposed to be about. They CHOSEN to not make any money and they CHOSEN to find other ways to live instead of selling out and using the band's profits to buy a big house and a nice car.

    I'm still going to see the show because my girlfriend wants to see it but im pretty sure i will be disgusted...
     
  19. Mike Generic

    Mike GenericExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Mar 29, 2010
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    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    Has anyone here seen one of Steve Ignorants shows? I love seeing older bands play, because a lot of the time, they just keep getting better and better, but I feel like this one would be awful.
     
  20. Mike Generic

    Mike GenericExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Mar 29, 2010
     Canada
    Re: Crass playing in California and charging $23?

    Wow. I never though I'd see the day when Steve Ignorant would be on the cover of the Arts section of the Globe and Mail.

    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/art ... nt=1991639

     
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