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Osama Bin Laden Pronounced Dead.

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by JesusCrust, May 1, 2011.

  1. butcher

    butcherExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    that's the problem with our Commie pinko fingers, they fuck with our rationality ;)
     
  2. Mykill Von Doom

    Mykill Von DoomMember Forum Member


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    May I recommend Robert Newman's "History Of Oil" for the uninformed...

    [video]http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5267640865741878159#[/video]
     
  3. Bentheanarchist

    BentheanarchistExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    At first I thought I was dreaming that osama was dead; I never thought it would really actually happen.
     
  4. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Pakistan admitted today that the pictures of dead Osama are FAKE
     
  5. Septimiuss

    SeptimiussActive Member Forum Member


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    and Patty Hearst didn't enjoy herself.
     
  6. butcher

    butcherExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Win :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :ecouteurs: :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :ecouteurs: :thumbsup: :ecouteurs:
     
  7. vAsSiLy77

    vAsSiLy77Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    "Osama" Goldstein was always a fake - and I'm still looking for the source of some german journalists report about mujahideen training camps with english-speaking advisors or the dope-for-guns-trade across the pakistan/afghan border using pakistani-army trucks for transport, I think he made it for the french/german ARTE tv-channel.

    german radio is still running wild with official warnings about terrorist revenge - it's getting boooring, if you ask me.
     
  8. Derek Danger

    Derek DangerExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Jan 29, 2010
     
    Ummm... yeah, those photos have been out for years, and it wasn't as if the US ever said they were real. I suspect an internet shit-stirrer trying to get a chuckle out of the whole thing sent the photos in. Either that or a freelance journo of little ethical fibre sent them in and split with a cheque for his "exclusive".

    Also, a small correction:

    It was never "confirmed". And the paper that originated the story (I believe they were a French newspaper?) had pretty shaky sources, as was normally the case with Osama stories. Good way to shift papers, though.

    There have been only seven video tapes of Osama which are certain to actually contain him, two of which were intentionally mistranslated by the US. There were two more videos but one of them is composed of old footage and new audio spliced together and the other is almost certainly just of a man who looks quite like Osama but may not be (he writes with his wrong hand in the video, with apparent ease; wears gold jewellery, which is Haram; and is considerably fatter, with shorter fingers). The rest of the releases are some dozen-or-so "confirmed" audiotapes, and several dozen others; but all of them could have been made by anybody at all.
     
  9. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    It was confirmed that he was hospitalized for serious kidney problems

    http://www.prisonplanet.com/bin_laden_t ... pital.html
     
  10. Caps

    CapsExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    The US is refusing to release photos of his corpse. Apparently, dumping his body in the sea wasn't sufficient fuel to the conspiracy nutters' fire. What's more, there story has changed - now he was unarmed and he didn't hide behind a woman. So now we have an inconsistent story as the only proof this went down.

    I'd thought he'd been dead for years, between the rumours of kidney problems (good luck of getting a dialysis machine working in some shit-hole cave...) and gangrene. The effectiveness of his actions post-9/11 are practically nil. He may as well have been dead for years for all he's done. Really, this should have brought comfort to the families of 9/11 victims and nothing else. However, from the news reports I've seen, it's released a lot of American death-boners.
     
  11. Derek Danger

    Derek DangerExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Jan 29, 2010
     
    Like I said, a story in a couple papers doesn't convince me. Especially when the only source quoted is another newspaper. In France. Seriously, show me their sources, prove their reliable and then it's confirmed. Also, when the use of the words "reportedly" and "allegedly" is employed almost as a matter of course, the story can be utter horseshit and still make press.
     
  12. butcher

    butcherExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    plus the source listed here is prisonplanet...
     
  13. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    lol so you think some journalists would have invented facts that ben laden was hospitalized for kidney problems ???

    ok listen, i just watched an interview with a french political expert, he's saying that Ben Laden was hospitalized for kidney problems. In fact, Ben Laden is sick of chronic renal insuffisance/failture (not sure of the english word) since 1985 !!!! He was also injured during the war against soviets... His kidney sickness require him to have frequent treatements in hospital...

    The source i quoted is some random website i found on google because my sources are in french. Wtf, why shouldn't we believe it just because it's from france ? wtf is this stupid anti-french american&co mentality ??
    The source of those french articles comes from a french agent in charge of intelligence in dubai.

    The ones who are pretending that kidney diseases are a lie is the US Government (the same ones that refuse to provide proof of his death), so you're going to tell me that US Government is a more reliabe source than independant journalists, political experts and analysis ?

    Back a couple of months ago, many government officials, anti-terrorist experts and other political experts were saying that Ben Laden is probably already dead, because of his kidney problems.

    I'm not a conspiracy theorist, i am not going to say that i am right but neither can you prove that ben laden really died a couple of days ago. I'm just saying that he MAY have died long time ago and the US are just lying to regain the faith they lost after 500 talibans evaded from an afghan prison (what a weird coincidence it happenned only a few weeks ago). They could have killed him many times before, they just wanted to keep it for the right moment. Not only they could have killed him in afghanistan in 2001 when he was surrounded, but they let him go... but they also have easily found him because all the medical treatements he needed were easy to trace. In the years after 2001, EVERYONE knew that Ben Laden was in Pakistan but the americans were not looking for him. I have a very interessing french documentary, a journalist goes in Pakistan in 2001 and ask everyone where is Ben Laden, you would be surprised to see how everyone know where exactly he is...

    Some other facts

    - In September 2001 ben laden was in a pakistan military hospital for kidney problems under the supervision of ISI, confirmed by french secret services
    - October 2001, he appears on a video where he is very sick and he cant move one of his arm
    - November 7 2001 is the last interview in person with Ben Laden, with journalist Hamid Mir from Pakistan
    - November 25, 2001 - Osama bin-Laden gives his last known public speech to his followers in Milawa, Afghanistan, a village located on the route from Tora Bora to the Pakistani border.
    - November 28, 2001 - Osama bin-Laden reportedly escapes Tora Bora
    - December 15, 2001 - Osama bin-Laden's voice is reportedly intercepted for the last time communicating with his fighters in Tora Bora via his shortwave radio
    - December 17, 2001 - US Intelligence and Pentagon officials admit they have lost Osama bin-Laden


    ** Mysteriously there isn't any interviews or real signs of life of Ben Laden after the first rumours on his death start*

    - December 26, 2001, Fox News report that Talibans officials told the journal "Paquistán Observer" died earlier in the month. Experts reported that he died of kidney failture because he didnt have the equippement for medical care.

    - December 26, 2001 - Article about Osama bin-Laden's funeral is published in Pakistan and Egypt. The funeral allegedly takes place about 10 days earlier. The article is also discussed by Fox News. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,41576,00.html

    - January 18, 2002, Pakistan president admitted that Ben Laden is dead.

    - July 17, 2001, FBI Anti-Terrorist leader (Dale Watson) admitted that Ben Laden is probably dead.

    - October 2002, Afghanistan President told CNN that Ben Laden is probably dead.

    - September 2006, we learnt that the french secret services knew that Ben Laden is dead in Pakistan

    - October 16, 2002 – Middle East Newsline reports that Israeli Intelligence officials confirmed that Israel and the United States believe Osama bin-Laden was killed in mid-December 2001 during the Tora Bora bombing campaign. http://www.welfarestate.com/binladen/fu ... -intel.txt

    - In march 2009 - the ex officier from "American foreign affairs information" and teacher of "International Relations" at the university of Boston (Angelo Codevilla), said that "it is obvious that Elvis Presley is more alive than Ossama Ben Laden"

    - May 2009, Pakistani President (Asif Ali Zardan) confirm that in 7 years they never heard of Ossama Ben Laden alive and his american secret service partners never heard of him neither. He admitted that he is probably not alive.


    There are also many other confusing reports:
    - That Ben Laden died in pakistan earthquake (Source Senator Harry Reid)
    - That Osama Ben Laden was killed by Omar Sheik
    - That he died of lungs problem complications (source Egyptian newspaper called al-Wafd)
    - Etc

    Some sources:
    http://littlecountrylost.blogspot.com/2 ... dered.html (LOTS of informations)
    http://www.legrandsoir.info/Les-9-morts ... Laden.html (in french)

    I don't understand how the word of Obama as the ONLY proof in this whole story is a fact that we should believe without questionement.
     
  14. Derek Danger

    Derek DangerExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    First of all:
    Get off your fecking high horse, my problem with the article being unsourced except for a sideways glance to a French newspaper is that France has had so little to do with Osama, and I'd rather take my unverified claims (although I still wouldn't believe them) from a reputable source (i.e. not a random journalist) that was close to the story (i.e. they made no indication in the story that the journalist had met with or spoken to anybody outside of France. Don't get touchy, I would have said the same thing about, for instance, Germany, Australia, Iceland, Greece, etc.

    Everything else you've said is perfectly reasonable, and you should've said it in the first place instead of pointing me to an article I've already read that I choose not to believe due to a near-aggressive lack of credibility.
     
  15. butcher

    butcherExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    I don't believe the last story cos its from prisonplanet, not cos its French...
     
  16. Derek Danger

    Derek DangerExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oh, wow! I just looked at the rest of prison planet. And here I was assuming it was just a slightly crappy news blog. Yeah, that site does not inspire me with confidence about the credibility of its posts!
     
  17. butcher

    butcherExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    alex jones ftw..
     
  18. QueerPunk

    QueerPunkExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    As much as I think Alex Jones is a total tosser I am still not a big fan of people resorting to ad hominem attacks to address a point that is being made.

    There are so many quotes that have overwhelming elements of truth to them but the people who were made famous for those quotes were evil bastards, ie Goering, Hitler, Goebbels or even Stalin (listed below):

    "...Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”

    'The great masses of the people will more easily fall victims to a big lie than to a small one."

    "How fortunate for governments that the people they administer don't think."

    “If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.

    “Whoever can conquer the street will one day conquer the state, for every form of power politics and any dictatorship-run state has its roots in the street.”

    "Education is a weapon whose effects depend on who holds it in his hands and at whom it is aimed."

    "It is enough that the people know there was an election. The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything."

    To attack a point by attacking the source it came from is a fallacy as far as any form of rational argument is concerned. What should be done is to analyse the claim based on the merits of the claim and not those who are saying it. That would be the logical approach. However I feel that people generally are too fucking stupid to get that idea around their thick heads, however I know both Butcher and Derek Danger and I am sure they can grasp a simple concept of not resorting to ad hominem fallacies.
     
  19. vAsSiLy77

    vAsSiLy77Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    Agreed, and besides this I still have to find out what's the importance of a death date in the great may-be/may-be not... :ecouteurs:
     
  20. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    hmm shit... i didnt know that.... i dont even know what prisonplanet is so im sorry for the shitty source, like i said my source is in french so i just tryed to google an english source

    here's a very serious political expert saying the same thing, but its in french
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=slNXe5bS ... r_embedded


    Anyway, like some french comrade said, we will never be able to know the truth, this is just another spectacle and we should focus on struggle against capitalism and the state...
     
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