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Jesus Christ

Discussion in 'General political debates' started by DrunkSquid, May 31, 2010.

  1. DrunkSquid

    DrunkSquidExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oct 11, 2009
     
    Prove to me that Jesus H Christ walked the earth 2000 years ago. Go ahead. I'm waiting.
     

  2. ghoul

    ghoulExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    I am pretty sure Jesus was a real man. I doubt he is the son of god anymore than I am or any of us are. What he was though was a radical activist that used non violent means to spread his message. Most of his message I can agree with. I have always enjoyed the story of him going to the temple and getting pissed at the corruption he saw there and start smashing up the place. I like the message of respecting your neighbor even if they may do things you disagree with. It's too bad way too many people miss the real message he was trying to spread and focus on the supernatural stuff people added later.
     
  3. Probe

    ProbeExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Yea as far as I now it IS a historic fact that someone called "Jesus" existed

    EDIT: I've always wondered why people say Jesus "H" Christ..I mean does it stand for anything?
     
  4. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    Hannibal, Jesus Hannibal Christ......... :o
     
  5. Bananaman

    BananamanExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oh... goodie a chance to post this...

    [​IMG]

    Uploaded with ImageShack.us
     
  6. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    woah so you believe in jesus now ??? the more i read from you the more i am desperate...

    Peoples doesnt miss the "real message" and this message isn't only about "respecting your neighbor" it is about creationism, the existence of god, miracles, and a lot of bullshit. If only it was only about mutual respect..... but this is definatly not the case.

    Also, jesus never existed like god never existed. It is an invention of the religion. And there are many texts that demonstrate the similarities between all religions to prove that their prophet was all the same person in the origins they just interpreted it differently. (i could post a couple of texts but they are all in french :()

    Claiming that jesus existed is accepting the face that he did miracles and walked on the water.



    As for god obviously he doesn't exist and if he really did exist and cared so much about us then where is he today to help us? Just look what is happenning all over the world, "i don't see him trying to stop the slaughter" like crass said. Even jerusalem is at war, peoples are dying all over the world of hunger and povrety, etc etc...

    Religion and god is what kept the humanity stupid for so long, it is the biggest nuisance to progress and to science... for so many years we thought that the earth wasn't round, we thought that the whole solar system was turning around the earth and that we were the middle of the universe, we thought that god created the men and the earth, etc...

    A good point to start is by reading Sebastien Faure's text (a famous french anarchist) called "the twelve proofs of non-existence of god)

    Anyway, even if good existed, we would need to get rid of him (like Bakunin said) because it is the supreme authority and in an anarchist/egalitarian point of view we would absolutly need to get rid of him.

     
  7. ghoul

    ghoulExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    You're funny. Did I say anything about believing the religion aspect? Nope. in fact I said this.
    I do not believe in religion. As far as god goes I don't know. Some day after I take my last breath I will find out but until then I don't know. No one can know that. I have died twice and I still can't answer that and neither can you.
     
  8. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    No. You're the one who is funny. I didn't talk about the son of god neither.

    What made Jesus famous is his miracles, the "fact" that he walked on the water, that he ressurected, etc...

    If you believe that Jesus existed then you also believe what he has done.... Or else what are you saying ? That there was someone called Jesus in year zero but that he wasn't the person the bible is talking about ??

    That doesn't makes any sense....
     
  9. ghoul

    ghoulExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    What I can't believe that there is a possibly of a man existing and saying fuck you to the corruption in the religion of his day? Do I have to believe the crazy mythology that others have placed on him? What made Jesus famous was his message of peace. Others created this other bullshit so they could turn it into religion.

    Was this man named Jesus? I can't say, I wasn't there. Stories that are passed down do tend to have a historical basis for them. Take the Noah's flood for an example. This story appears in legends in several culture. It has a historical basis but the facts have been exaggerated. There was in fact a massive flood thousands of years ago and created the Black Sea as we know it today. Does this mean that a man created a boat and filled it with every animal in the world? Hell no. You wouldn't be able to make it big enough to hold the feces let alone the animals. But this does not change the fact that there was a flood so big that thousands of years later stories are still told.

    Do I believe Jesus was god on Earth? No, that's just silly. Do I believe there may have been a man that questioned the authority of his time and promoted peace? Absolutely.
     
  10. Wooly

    WoolyExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 24, 2010
     
    I couldn't agree with you more, I may have eventually sided with Ungov in the "guns and anarchism" thread, but i dont think ill be swapping sides here.
     
  11. jejunum

    jejunumMember New Member


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    I wouldn't consider myself religious or atheist, but somewhere in between. I read the Bible because it's the most influential document in Western history (every few pages you come across the inspiration for some great work of literature), and because it's such a beautiifully-written book, regardless of who wrote it, who changed it, and when. I don't know if Jesus had any powers, but he was definitely a very enlightened man. I ddn't believe in original sin or hell or heaven, but i definitely believe in God. (And don't yell at me becuase of it.)

    Although religion can corrupt a society, it can also be life-affirming. (Look at Unitarian Universalism.)
     
  12. jejunum

    jejunumMember New Member


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    Jesus H. Christ comes from the Greek abbreviation for Christ, JHC. Non-Greek-speaking people wondered what it stood for, so they figured that the J must be for Jesus, the C, for Christ, and H must be his middle initial.
     
  13. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    There is no proof of the existence of jesus. If you know this story today it is because the religion made it famous. In fact, you are not better than a christian believer if you believe this bullshit.

    Wow and now you believe the biblic legends ahahahaha

    Seriously... You really call yourself an anarchist ?

    Noah's flood isn't just a little flood made by rain and that ended up in long-term to create a sea... Noah's flood is about the WHOLE EARTH being flooded by water. Scientifically, this is definatly impossible.

    Anyway i'm loosing my time with you. You're like that NGNM85 integrist, you absolutly refuse to question yourself and you won't listen to anything, no matter what the subject is.

    There was thousands of peoples who critized the authority and promoted a more peaceful religion back in that time, it's called the pagans. Still doesn't have any link with jesus.

    So in conclusion.... You believe that someone existed but he wasn't called Jesus, and this person haven't done one percent of what jesus is supposed to have done..... Why the fuck do you claim that Jesus existed ? That makes no sence.

    http://www.straightdope.com/columns/rea ... s-h-christ
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus_H._Christ
     
  14. ghoul

    ghoulExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    What part of exaggerated facts don't you understand. That story is in more than just the bible. It shows up in every culture in the middle east as well as Greek and Egyptian legends.

    This is what really happened. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_deluge_theory http://www.robotwisdom.com/science/blacksea.html It wasn't caused by rain but melting glaciers. It didn't cover the entire Earth but for the people living there it did seem to cover their entire world. This is the science behind the legends.
     
  15. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    So what ?? every culture talks about some prophet like jesus who walked on the water and did a bunch of miracles... Does it means it's true just because some 2000 years old books talks about it??

    It has absolutly nothing to do with the bible legend. It didn,t cover the entire earth and more importantly it didn't happen spontanously... Do you really think a melting glacier cause a flooding in a couple of days ??? This is a very long phenomena.


    Your arguments are so dumb it's not even worth my time. You say Jesus existed but you admit he hasn't done anything he supposedly did following what the bible says. Then you do the same for noah's flood. That's pathetic...

    Anyway your theory is totally worthless since the dates doesn't even match

    http://www.answersingenesis.org/creatio ... _flood.asp
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Sea_deluge_theory

    there's like 3000 years of difference between the black sea deluge and noah's flood.



    http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news ... ood_2.html
    2000 square kilometers.

    And all the articles linked to the wikipedia page says it CONTRACICTS noah's flood theory, it doesn't say that this flood is true like you said.
     
  16. ghoul

    ghoulExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    You know I am flattered that you would single me out in every thread. Even when there are others that agree with me. Truely I am flattered.
     
  17. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    What a comeback! Obviously you don't know what to say so you just ignore my arguments. Are you NGNM85's twin brother or what?

    Peoples who agree with you here? Oh really? Where?

    Even if there were peoples who agree with you it doesn't change anything to the fact that you are wrong

    BTW saying i try to prove you wrong on all threads is just paranoia. So far the only thread i replyed to you beside this one is the topic that I have started about guns. YOU are the one who jumped in, started to prove me wrong, and kept bringing up your shitty NRA arguments over and over again without giving up.
     
  18. Bunny

    BunnyExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Mar 13, 2010
     
    ummmm... who? Probe just said that historically there was a man named jesus, and there are men named jesus today too( its just pronounced differently)
    But back to the original question, the only proof that anyone can offer is a fictional book that constantly contradicts its self. And as far as I'm concerned he didn't exist.
     
  19. Wooly

    WoolyExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Reporting In.

    I dont think Noah's ark and other "bible myths" are that important. It is the view of the modern catholic church (ie. The pope, The Vatican, the church as an organisation) that the old testament (the part of the bible that contains the story of Noah's ark and other creationist stories) is basically a way of explaining the world, similar to Australian Aboriginal dream time stories, or any other story form any other culture that basically says "The earth was created like this, then a whole bunch of other stuff happened". They say it is not to be taken 100% word for word literally.

    I believe (Note use of the word "believe", this is a faith thing, im going to say it a lot in the next paragraph) That Jesus did exist 2000 years ago around the area of Jerusalem. I do NOT believe he was the son of god, i believe he was a MAN. I believe that he saw the wealthy Jews in the area had become corrupt, he saw the romans who ruled over his people with an iron fist. I believe that he started preaching the fundamentals of Judaism, but with some new twists added in that helped people to understand. I believe that after he was killed, a bunch of dudes wrote a book about him, depicting him as the messiah and the son of god, and wrote about him performing miracles. If you read the new testament of the bible (witch i have not done, not cover to cover anyway), you would see that there is a lot more focus on Jesus' teachings than there are on his miracles.

    I dont get whats so bad and Un-anarchist about believing in god. Isn't anarchism about freedom? Im not saying its about doing whatever you want, so dont single me out on that like i know you will. What im trying to get across is that in a free society, wouldn't it make sense to have freedom of religion? Ive heard people on this website talking about burning the churches after the revolution, although im not religious myself, i dont like the idea of forcing a world of non-religiousness on to people. I feel like thats as bad as forcing religion on to people.
     
  20. colton_and

    colton_andExperienced Member Experienced member


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    Mar 24, 2010
     
    I dont believe in god or anything, but jesus i think did at one point 2010 years ago, live.

    but religion makes people happy, even if it minipulates poeple into believing something that isnt true. so ungov, explain to me how religion , believeing in god is such a terrible thing?
     
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