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How does one live outside the system?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by joemcc13, Nov 14, 2012.

  1. awk321

    awk321New Member New Member


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    Sep 3, 2012
     
    I wouldn't go alone , the loneliness will eat away at you . Not to mention no one will be able to help you if an emergency situation happens .
     
  2. Danarchy

    DanarchyExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Jan 16, 2012
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    There are a number of concepts floating around about what living 'outside the system' and they all have drawbacks and benefits. Urban squatting and dumpster diving was great to me when I was in my teens and early 20's, living in a van, working seasonal temporary jobs was wonderful in my late 20's and early 30's, now I'm homesteading and raising two children with my partner, living off the land and making some cash selling organic produce and some homemade crafts. Each period in my live provided me with the level of freedom and sense of purpose that I needed at that time. Unlike many of those who I lived with/ around I made a choice to proceed in a clear direction towards a balance between living within contemporary society and living outside of it. Most of the personal freedom that I have sacrificed in my life (opting in or selling out depending on your point of view) has been done for others. I moved from the freedom of hitchhiking and being fairly cash free to the burden of a van and it's associated costs for my partner for a little bit of privacy, comfort and security, we moved from that to homesteading for our children.

    Living 'outside the system' is sociological not economic. You can not live economically outside the system, eveything, even trade and barter relies to some extent on the economic system of the state although I would agree that I am creating black/ white contrasts where shades of grey are more appropriate. For some people this means squatting and dumpster diving, for others it means acquiring the means of existance from nature through their own skills. The former being based in the urban context the latter being rural although there are possibilities to squat in the rural context I have (thankfully) yet to see many dumpsters in the forest.

    I no longer squat. I chose to sacrifice several years of my life to regular employment to acquire sufficient funds to 'buy' land. This choice was made for my children and the over shadowing fear of child services who routinely seize children whose parents choose to live 'outside the system'. We have also just decided to leave a Co-op/ commune that wasn't as intentional in the manner we would have preferred (refer to my other posts regarding the farm). We are now relocating to Nova Scotia in the new year and acquiring around 10 acres of land that the contemporary system would refer to as ours. 10 acres is about the minimum I would recommend for a homestead, it should also have a water source, between 2-3 acres cleared with the remaining as mature a forest as you can find to build a timber/ cord wood home, wildharvest and for winter firewood. In about a week with a shovel, spade and 8" pruning saw and you could build a reasonable settler's home (Sod) and begin your truly "outside the system" life, about $200 in seed and a bit of seed saving knowledge is about all you need to start out with. BUT this is my way of doing things and it is NOT for the weak hearted or those with limited knowledge and skills (re:urban).

    You could try following your passion and spend a season WWOOF'ing. Here in Canada we have an organisation called SOIL that matches people with agricultural internships typically on small certified organic farms for a season, don't know if the US or individual states have similar systems. Both of those systems offer an opportunity to learn the how to's of homesteading but your experience will really be a reflection of the 'hosting' farms you choose as both systems have 'real' opportunities and others that are just exploiting people.

    Also, while I chose one path my partner chose another living for 8 years in Englands traveller community out of a yurt and a horse drawn carrage both of which she made herself out of salvaged and wild harvested materials. She only stopped 'living the life' after giving birth to her daughter alone in the trailer along the side of the road waiting for a midwife.
     
  3. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Nov 13, 2009
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    Hey Dan good to hear from you again, sorry it didn't work out at the farm...what was the final motivating factor in the move? So you are moving to the East Coast now right? That's quite a change in location...the best of luck to you and your family and please as always keep us posted on your progress at your convenience of course...cheers.
     
  4. Danarchy

    DanarchyExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Jan 16, 2012
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    Hey PM

    Sorry to have been gone so long but it was a difficult season. The biggest factor was financial. The fair market value for the property was far higher than what could be affordably 'bought' into. BC land values are way too high due to influences from Vancouver, Toronto and Alberta. We could have continued to run the farm as a family co-op but I'm not interested in running a business that relies on employing people. No matter how 'good' of an employer I could be the concept of financial exchange for the most valuable least expendable commodity in a persons life (time) is not something I could accept. How can you really value something that can not be measured? Sure, I can estimate and place a numerical value on the commercial value of time based on production and sales and I do have calculations for it based on crops but, philosopically speaking, no matter of compensation can adequately compensate another person for such a finite resource. My partner and I decided that we would be happier downscaling the operation but others did not share our opinion and refused to downsize. I felt that at the size of operation we really did not have the time ourselves to adequately share our skills and knowledge with those who came to work with us. Given the consensus model of the Co-op it was not something we could change nor under the rules of the Co-op could we remain and not participate. Maybe it was too intentional? I could go on but it certainly wasn't a failure just not the right fit those that remain are happy with the Co-op as it is.

    I am in Nova Scotia at the moment living out of my truck and looking for a good place. Compared to BC, land is about insanely cheap. For the same amount we paid for our tractor in BC I can get 10 acres of land and a house. It will be hard to get our self sufficiency going and start generating a small revenue but it is definately worth the effort for anyone truly desiring a simpler, independant kind of live. Also the places I have seen are the kind you see across the midwest with boarded windows, slumping roofs and over grown fields. A reflection of hard times and broken dreams of the past.
     
  5. punkmar77

    punkmar77Experienced Member Staff Member Uploader Admin Team Experienced member


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    Fascinating, I can completely respect your stance as anarchist to the core about the farm, and bringing some forgotten and abandoned land back to sustainability is no small feat...nothing but the best wishes to you and your family my friend...
     
  6. Dave Samsara

    Dave SamsaraActive Member Forum Member


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    Nov 17, 2012
     
    I wonder how far outside the system you need to be before you are truly outside the system. And how do you measure or judge that?
    Even when outside of the system, we'd still be living within a social construct, which in itself would still be a system.
    There will always be a social system, the nature of consciousness and individual ego dictates that.

    You're gonna tell me i've missed the point, which I probably have. And I know that.
     
  7. anessen

    anessenActive Member Forum Member


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    Jan 1, 2010
     
    My dream was always to live out of a camper van and be self employed fixing electrical and electronic devices as a way of supporting myself. Don't think it's practical though.
     
  8. Danarchy

    DanarchyExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Not missing the point Dave, I would say making the point. From my experience living 'outside the system' is more about opting out of the predominant consumer social culture rather than opting out of society itself which would be extremely difficult, not to mention lonely. Many of the 'outside the system' lifestyles are based on living off the wastes of the consumption system rather than co-operating or colluding with it. Life and lifestyles are very subjective, what is living outside the system to one may be considered leaching off the system to another.
     
  9. Dave Samsara

    Dave SamsaraActive Member Forum Member


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    Nov 17, 2012
     
    I deeply admire individuals or groups of people who can live sustainably on the land and avoid getting caught up in the machinery of modern societies’ ‘system’. It’s very difficult, requires great courage and fortitude. But its not possible for everyone.

    Those of us ‘living in the world’ so to speak need to live with awareness of the insipid socialisation process that continually and often subtly bends us to conform to roles that we often feel we have chosen for ourselves. This includes the angry revolutionary as much as the ignorant Tory.

    Anger is often as much a socialised reaction taking place within the system as it is a deliberate act of subversion. Anger can be turned into positive action taking place from within the system, helping damaged individuals and groups of people work towards liberation. Surely that is real revolutionary activity.

    Society can provide a structure to work with – rather than fighting against. Gandhi (with all his faults) spoke the truth when he said ‘be the change you want to see in the world’. We can change on the individual level, inspiring people along the way, educating, leading by example… the tide will slowly turn. Very slowly.

    Aggression breeds polarisation and resistance, no matter how just the cause. Surely we don’t want to fight our fellow (wo)men, but inspire to change?

    Idealist? Maybe….!!!
     
  10. IamMe

    IamMeExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Dec 29, 2012
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    i live in uk and are planning on moving to a commune where the people there live in ti-pi's, yurts, caravans (trailers) and even round houses made from the very land they are living on. i decided to try this life style while im still young and have the dedication to see it to the end. making a change of life style like this dosent happen over night as i have come to realise, i have planned to get a job and save up for a year or untill i have about £2000. i have chosen that the ti-pi will be the most practicle as you can have a fire inside to keep you warm and to cook food plus its the cheapest option, food is the most chalangeng ecspecaily when you first start out because you gota wait for your food to grow so, i would need money to buy food. growing veggies in the winter is posible in the U.K when your using a pollytunnel but life would still be hard as it rains nearly every day, so i would probably end up moving back to a small town to get a job during the wet winter months to save up more money for the summer. plus i dont really drink much i would rather weed and i can grow that in the summer :lmao: it is nearly imposible to live free of the system in the U.K and U.S because we have lost the knowledge our ansectors had, but with time, effort and dedication we can do any thing we put our minds to, even be one with the earth agian. if there's any one who is already living this way i would appreciate some advice and giudence, but then agian some one who was living free from the system wouldent have the internet.
     
  11. IamApirate

    IamApirateNew Member New Member


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    Dec 31, 2012
     
    Don't live outside of it, Change it... then pee on them. :ecouteurs:
     
  12. nclpw

    nclpwExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 25, 2012
     
    why while you`re still young? you can start a lifestyle like that at any age.
     
  13. Scumfuckk

    ScumfuckkMember New Member


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    Jan 8, 2013
     
    SLAB MOTHERUCKING CITY, with all the good folkpunk, weed, and meth, it sounds like my kind of place
     
  14. IamMe

    IamMeExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Dec 29, 2012
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    NCLPW i do agree with you, but from what i have excperinced as you get older you come to except the system and the shity life they lay out for you. my dad was a punk in the 80's and the first band he saw was crass (he is an original anarchist) but once he had me n my sis he had to settle down and suport his family 9-5 job, bills and all the rest, he does say though that he is guted he dident bring me up in the traveler lifestyle. thats why i think its best to do this while your young and have no responnsibility's, although you cant wait till your kids move out then start living this life, but your gunna be older and may not have the motivation to do so. I could never bring a child into this system just to get raped by fat politicians and there even fatter wifes. and ye slabcity does sound wicked, i saw a documentry on it not long ago. i would love to go there but i dont think you can hitch a ride across the atlantic ocean.
     
  15. nclpw

    nclpwExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 25, 2012
     
    It doesn't have to be that way. You might not get shitfaced every weekend anymore, but you can still be an activist/not accept the system and the shitty life they lay out for us.
    Of course if you get kids and all that you'd probably want to settle somewhere, but finding a place to live and a job is no defeat.
     
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