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Fuck the 4-skins! Boycott em'

Discussion in 'Music, punk scene & subcultures' started by SurgeryXdisaster, Jul 31, 2010.

  1. seitan

    seitanExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Nov 7, 2009
     
    crane was also head of skrewdriver security.
     
  2. JOE01

    JOE01Active Member Forum Member


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    Yeah erm well new here but was reading this post- well out of fucking order, fucking boneheads. Not really sure what I make of a certain London area punk band oh fuck what were they called..... that's it 'Anoraks' have a song called 'suicide bomber' and it’s on the playlist of an EDL thug's Youtube channel, if you must torture your self scrole down this fuckers page http://www.youtube.com/user/UKGovsucksT ... 977DA44E4A
    Played a gig were they were put on the bill at the last minute and thought summit was maybe not right about em. I dunno what people feel but it always makes me uncomfortable when I see 'punks' and especially 'skins' with union jack t-shirts. My view on this Anoraks thing, is well not a good song for a start, a bit sensationalist, not really sure what their point is, but they don't seem like the kind of band who would take any kind of stance against the EDL probably quite respect them by the sound of that ‘dodgy’ song and the union jack/ St. Georges attire they wear. I did think about contacting them and saying by the way do you know the EDL are aligning themselves with your music, but then thought, what's the fucking point? I don't know that band personally; I do however suspect they are not anti-fascists and have right-wing sympathies. I also noticed one or two vaguely 'punk' types in footage of that EDL demo. Sadly there are patriot punks out there and I don't have time for such people. Fuck Nationalism, Fuck Racism and Fuck the 4-skins!
     
  3. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    I never heard about nicky crane being a member of the 4 skins, where did you get that from ?
     
  4. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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  5. JackNegativity

    JackNegativityExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Nov 9, 2010
     
    Nosax is mistaken, Crane was never in the 4skins. I read the "Spirit of 69" book back in the day, it mentions that Crane was an openly gay BNP bonehead and head of Skrewdriver security, but never mentioned any connection to the 4skins other than the "Strength Thru Oi!" cover. None of the other articles I've read on the 4skins (as they were once one of my favorite bands) has ever mentioned it either.
     
  6. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    I think you misread nosax, he said "as well as a member of the 4skins" in other words, in addition to Crane, 1 of the 4skins was a member as well...
     
  7. JackNegativity

    JackNegativityExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    my bad
     
  8. nosax

    nosaxNew Member New Member


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    Oct 8, 2010
     
    OK, just to clarify, Gary Hitchcock , member then MANAGER of the 4-skins, was a member of the British Movement. He and Nicky Crane went on to found Combat 18.
     
  9. TottenhamSean

    TottenhamSeanMember New Member


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    Feb 20, 2011
     
    So many inaccuracies chaps.
    The 4skins were never a racist band,despite what has been and will continue to be written about them.
    The band Members were all pretty much up front on where they stood Politically.
    The manger and Singer were reformed right wingers, the drummer no interest, the Guitarist was left of labour and the bassist described himself as being pretty liberal(though he didnt dress like a geography Teacher it has to be said).
    After the band split up(8 years after,so i cant see how you canlay that on the band) the manger obviously had another rethink (if the stories are true)&went on to form(allegedly) a far right organisation, but it wasn't with Nicky Crane(as far as im aware he had no connection with C18,he died in 93 ,only a year after C18 formed).So i don't know where that story came from.
    Also the bit about skinheads "why would any one want to be part of a a subculture where you actually have to claim your anti-racism"
    Most of us never felt the need to claim anything mate.if others have their opinions already cemeted in their tiny brains, then f**k em! I never gave a monkies what most people thought about me throughout my days as a skinhead.As long as my Family and friends had a idea what i was about, that was good enough for me.
     
  10. Bakica

    BakicaExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Feb 21, 2010
     
    although all the so called "Oi Skinhead" band created in '70s & '80s weren't racists, they were patriots. And as far as I know, patriotism isn't welcome here. Nowadays, they are considered to be right wing becouse of their lyirics, and messages. This topic is not about skinheads, and their tradition, but about 4-Skins.
     
  11. 4-skins

    4-skinsMember New Member


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    thanks tottenham Sean someone with some sense.....so lets deal in facts instead of fiction here
    fact : the 4-skins are NOT nazis never have been and never will be......this is just a complete joke
    fact : none of the 4-skins are associated with any political organisation right or left
    fact : the 4-skins support the troops and their families not the war
    fact : we have no control who turns up to concerts we hope people enjoy the music and beer and leave their political views at home
    fact : our fathers and grandfathers fought and died fighting Fascists and nazis so we could all live in a free society
    fact : a certain song on the new album was criticised for being against immigrants - it was not it was about the UK's policy on illegal immigration and the impact it is having on the UK , not all immigrants, If you don't live in the UK you wouldn't know.
    fact : being a nationalist does not make you a nazi, wearing a union jack doesn't make you a racist
    fact : being as far left is just as extreme as being far right
    fact : the band members have many friends both black, white and asian hardly racist.
    fact : we don't really care what you all think - a skinhead is his own person - has his own beliefs - Oi music has always sung about patriotism - politics etc etc..so what is new - why the fuss now - the world is pc mad !!!!!!!! it has been hijacked by nazis and sharps its all bollocks
    fact : Nikki Crane was never in the 4-skins
    fact : skinheads never started the riot in southall the asian community did because they were against the gig going ahead .....i was there, were you?
    fact : some sharps are nationalist what does that mean?
    fact : unless you lived in london and home counties in the early 80's late 70's the NF and BM were rife especially at football and as most skins went to football it wasn't uncommon for skins to be associated and targeted by these groups but people do grow up and change their opinions and move on seems like alot of people are still in the past. This is just what it was like then, mass unemployment, race riots...shit happens
    all this bollocks its been around for years its nothing new - we are so use to the bullshit
    skinheads originated in the uk from mods and jamaican rude buoy immigrants, Oi originated in the uk as did punk, you should be thankful you all have something to talk about now for fuck sake jog on....ere sean Chelsea to finish 4th above you lol

    you can go on forever saying he used to be this and they were that...times change ...people move on...you have to associate it with what was happening at the time unless you were there you cant comment antifa1970 makes some valid points.

    we will always speak our minds - not everyone will like it - thats just tough - NEVER SORRY
     
  12. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    Whatever else you may have said, punk was here in this shitty country long before the UK ever got wind of it, all the fashion in punk came from copying Richard Hell and anyone worth his salt knows this, no Stooges, no punk, the west coast had punk bands long before any English band ever started playing it, so don't try to rewrite history to suit you...You want to start singing nationalistic songs against illegal immigrants then reap what you sew, whether you give a fuck or not, we and many like us do give a fuck when your words influence other dimwits to lash out and even murder. Fuck your indifference, fuck your apathy, fuck your callousness, fuck your nationalism, and most of all fuck you.
     
  13. Derek Danger

    Derek DangerExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Jan 29, 2010
     
    Punkmar, I actually applauded when I read your post. Just thought you should know.
     
  14. 4-skins

    4-skinsMember New Member


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    punkmar77 I,m talking bout the Oi/punk movement/ what you call punk and what we call punk are 2 different entities....what is punk ? your interpretation is open to debate ..... there you go again making something outa nothing we have never encouraged anyone to murder what a fucking stupid statement complete over-reaction as usual..... like i said we dont really care what you think....you have your own views...i respect that.....but that doesn't make you right everyone has a right to speak there mind and hey just for your information we have been reaping what sew for 30 years so nothing new there
     
  15. 4-skins

    4-skinsMember New Member


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    punkmar77 . illegal immigration not illegal immigrants...there is a difference don't rewrite to suit you. the US obviously dose not have any illegal immigration problems.....!!!!!!????? as does Australia......... whats wrong with the subject its a fact of life
     
  16. 4-skins

    4-skinsMember New Member


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    pnkmar77 : like i said down to interpretation

    The beginnings of punk rock are often furiously debated. This is partially because everyone has different definition of punk rock, and partially because its foundation stones are found in several places.

    "Punk Rock" was originally used to describe the garage musicians of the '60's. Bands like the Sonics were starting up and playing out with no musical or vocal instruction, and often limited skill. Because they didn't know the rules of music, they were able to break the rules.

    The mid to late '60s saw the appearance of the Stooges and the MC5 in Detroit. They were raw, crude and often political. Their concerts were often violent affairs, and they were opening the eyes of the music world.

    The Velvet Underground is the next piece in the puzzle.

    The Velvet Underground, managed by Andy Warhol, were producing music that often bordered on noise. They were expanding the definitions of music without even realizing it.

    The final primary influence is found in the foundations of Glam Rock. Artists like David Bowie and the New York Dolls were dressing outrageously, living extravagantly and producing loud trashy rock and roll. Glam would end up splitting up its influence, doling out portions to hard rock, "hair metal" and punk rock.
     
  17. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    likewise is yours, you made the statement that punk is from the UK, I just beg to differ

    I didn't say you encouraged anyone to murder, but you are responsible for the words you emanate, and you know you have a questionable side of skinheads following you that aren't the brightest bunch. I may, or may not be overreacting...however with a following and a history as large as yours, you can't just decide you don't care about the consequences of your influence and how that affects other humans, whether they are 'Illegal' or not. Which brings up the point, who makes immigration legal or illegal? The State.

    Well if that were true you wouldn't bother responding now would you. In all fairness you are asking Anarchists if they think there is an 'Illegal Immigration' problem in the countries in which they happen to reside, well we don't believe in borders, or the power of the State, or the imposition of their laws in the support of murderous capitalism so your question is quite moot.
     
  18. punkmar77

    punkmar77Administrator Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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    You are missing the whole west coast in your timeline with so many bands that I really don't feel like debating it, but yeah you did mention the major talking points.
     
  19. JackNegativity

    JackNegativityExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Shit, man. There's no way you can argue FOR nationalism. Nationalism is the foundation of fascism. Patriotism is rhetoric that justifies nationalism and ultimately fascism. Saying you're nationalist but not fascist is an oxymoron.


    Not everyone with certain political views will join an orginization. Your statement is pointless.


    That's the typical fence-sitter response. You're either part of the solution or part of the problem. Not denouncing the bones and telling them they're not welcome is the same as inviting them and spitting in the face off all those black friends you spoke of.


    Having to justify or prove you have friends of other races comes of as underlying subconsious racism, being as you identify them as races THEN friends. If you're not racist (and I believe you were actually the first to bring up the subject in this thread) then don't use this line anymore.

    Also, black white and asian are THREE races (technically one - human), not TWO. The word "both" doesn't apply.


    No, that would be an OPINION, not a fact. And how so? Take the nazis and anarchists...nazis were attempting to exterminate an entire religious/ethnic (however you choose to see it) group, build an empire and ultimately achieve world domination. The anarchists were fighting to rule themselves champion equality and human rights. How are they the same at all? Fuck fence-sitter rhetoric.

    From what I've seen oi was originally about class politics. So you're a poor working class kid--no job, no money, trying hard to survive in an increasingly hostile environment because your government is fucking you dry. You're disposable, cannon-fodder for the military at best in your countries eyes--HOW THE FUCK CAN YOU BE PATRIOTIC? Patriotic Oi is just a fence-sitter-friendly way of saying R.A.C.

    It means some SHARPs are fucking idiots. Same as everyones else...every group has them.

    Sure did. And you spit in their face and dishonor their legacy by associating with bonehead fucks, not to mention your pseudo-nazi stance on immigration. Do you really think ALL those Jamaicans were there "legally"?


    And another thing. All this "we don't care what you think" shit, yet here you are on an anarchist website....caring.

    You went from:
    like you didn't know this guy, to:
    showing that it is in fact a friend of yours, meaning you obviously cared enough to come here (even though you don't care), or you're one and the same person. Whether this is or isn't actually someone from the 4skins is irrelevent, i guess. Facts are facts, unless they're one of the opinions you threw in there and called a fact.

    If you don't care what people think, why are you here?
     
  20. Caps

    CapsExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    \m/ \m/ \m/
    I was going to say much of this myself. And also a true hail to Punkmar's post too. I'm now going to do my own replying.
     
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