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Freedom Of Speech?

Discussion in 'General political debates' started by Anxiety69, May 15, 2010.

  1. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    There is NO such thing as absolute freedom of speech, even in the US that makes a fetish of the notion. Check out the UN Charter of Human Rights for example, your freedom of expression is curtailed by the requirement to protect the reputation of others. Hence there are laws regarding libel and slander. Every country has national security laws that prevent you from divulging state secrets, just ask Manning, Kiriarkou or Assange where their freedom of speech has gotten them. Then their are contractual arrangements such as commercial in confidence, non disclosure and copyright laws [ever wonder what's in those 11 herbs and spices or the formula for Coke?]. There are laws against racial vilification in some countries as well. Those arguing for their absolute freedom of speech are asking to be allowed to insult, intimidate, discriminate or vilify whomever or whatever they please. They want the right to be bigoted arseholes and the platforms to do so without consequences. Invariably their gree speech is just hate speech, and that is NEVER acceptable.Dickheads that call for the genocide of their favourite scapegoats are actually breaking international law, namely the Convention against Genocide and the prohibition against war propaganda. In countries that are signatories to the Rome Convention of the International Criminal Court are theoretically liable for promoting genocide. People have been jailed for this crime. So in summary there is no such thing as absolute freedom of speech. If you think so, then you are denying reality and are delusional.
     
  2. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    I've already had my say on this topic on the last page, and I believe that the people on this site agree with the rules, and that these rules are a good thing that help protect the site, and the safety of the members, so I won't go into it any further except to say that it's just common sense to not yell theater in a crowded fire. (It's also very rude to do so)
     
  3. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    I was getting on my hobby horse for all those absolute free speech types out there. I'm glad this site has set boundaries, I'd hate having to deal with fascist or nazi trolls here. If I want to read conspiracy theories, anti-semitism,Islamophobia, homophobia or misogyny et-al then I'll go to RT's comments section or Information Clearing House [or even youtube].
     
  4. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    It seems that the administrator are on top of that, and seem to do a good job bouncing those people. This IS Anarcho-Punk DOT net, and NOT 4 Chan. (Although I suspect 50% of the posters there are LARPing)
     
  5. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    What is LARPing?
     
  6. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    Live Action Role Playing.
     
  7. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    Fark I'm getting old. I'm gonna have to google that.
     
  8. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    It's basically people pretending to be something they aren't. In real life, you'll see it a mid evil fairs. (I know that's not the right spelling, but you know what i mean) On line, it's a bit more difficult to suss out, but most of the time, it can be a form of trolling.
     
  9. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    Gotcha, thanks for the heads up. I was bloody clueless about it. Next step is learning to identify a LARP.
     
  10. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    Not as easy on the internet as it is in real life.
    One good indication is trolling, but that doesn't mean that all trolls are LARPing. Sometimes you just have to trust your own instincts. Best of luck.
     
  11. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    I can usually spot a troll miles away. This sounds like a sneakier version. They give themselves away soon enough. I got my baptism of fire with hasbara trolls on Al Jazeera's comments section back in 2014 during the attack on Gaza.
     
  12. LordManHammer

    LordManHammerMember Forum Member


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    Political correctness is language control.
    And language control is thought control. Period. The rise of modern political correctness (PC) is a great example of the cunning way in which social engineers such as the New World Order manipulators operate. Political correctness is soft censorship. It is intolerance disguised as tolerance. As George Carlin said, it is fascism pretending to be manners. It is running amok not just in Universities but now almost everywhere in society. Just as Orwell laid out so precisely in 1984, political correctness is the Newspeak which is threatening to limit our ability to freely speak and think, by reducing the number of available words in our vocabulary.

    I agree with a lot of the ideas of consequences after "freedom of speech" but it does seem like it is a modern news speak (albeit 1984), and as anarchist's we should be allowed to say without the hyper vigilant of pigeonholing someone, oh you are racist or sexist or whatever else that's negative. I agree in calling them an idiots and moving on, no more no less lets starve the trolls.
     
  13. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    I've brought this up before, but after reading your post, I think I will bring it up again.

    Back in September, I decided to recite the lyrics of White Punks on Hope by Cra$$ as a spoken word piece at an open mike which I am now boycotting. I won't go into detail of why I did this, except to say that somebody made a big fuss about somebody naming their horse "Blackie" and deciding that it was racist. Unfortunately nobody was familiar with CRA$$ or that song, so when I got to "The N Word" that's ALL anybody heard. Nobody bothered to listen to what was actually being said, or the message conveyed in the original lyrics. The next week, I decided to recite a Langston Hughes' short story about racism, and how it affects everybody INCLUDING WHITE PEOPLE! (Particularly THE IRISH) While reading the short story, I got into character, so to speak. The host of the open mike cut me off before I could finish, even though I was almost done, and only had one short sentence left. After I was kicked off the stage, the host of the open mike screamed in my face that what I did was "Racist" and if I ever said the N word on their stage again, I would be BANNED. Mind you this is an open mike that I've been going to and performing at for 20 years, and people who know me KNOW that I AM NOT A RACIST! I had a copy of the lyrics of White Punk on Hope with me, and I offered them up to the host se they could read it for themselves, and understand the context of how that word was used. They were having none of it. So in sarcasm, I asked if they preferred the censored version of Huck Finn, whereas they replied that they didn't care about Huck Finn or Mark Twain, and then said I was "Making up excuses" and proceeded to call me a "Nonce". I'm not sure what a "Nonce" is, but it sounds synonymous with "Idiot". I have come to the conclusion, that in the name of fighting racism, this open mike host would ban John Lennon, Patti Smith, The Dead Kennedys, Lenny Bruce, Jeff Dunham, and Gabriel "Fluffy" Iglasias from performing at their so called "Open Mike".

    I still think about this once a day, and it is driving me further into a deep depression. I'm even considering seeking professional help because of it. I gave twenty years of my life and countless thousands of dollars to this bar, and this is how a long time loyal customer is treated?

    Now, if I had performed a Skrewdriver song, especially one that spells out clearly and articulately it's racialist politics, that would be one thing, but to recite a song, and a story about why racism is bad, and be called a racist, and not be able to explain my side of the story, or to demonstrate the context of how words were used, and why, (And remember, I even had a copy of the lyrics to White Punks on Hope with me for inspection) is political correctness gone too far.
     
  14. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    Mate, I'm truly sorry this incident has affected/traumatised you so much. I for one do not believe that you are either a racist or a nonce. I hate to tell you but over here and in the UK, a nonce is a paedophile [we also call them rock spiders or spiders for short]. The person that said THAT to you has engaged in heavy duty slander, deserving legal action. They are scum! And you truly don't deserve shit talk like that being flung at you. If you can access free or low cost counselling, then I think that course of action would be of benefit. You have been unjustly accused in a very public and humiliating manner that you did not deserve. You'll need to accept that that venue is closed to you and in the past now. This means that you are going through a grieving process, but remember you will get through it. Try to remember the good times you experienced there and that you have better things to concern yourself with than a pack of intolerant arsewipes. Seriously look for another open mike venue within which you can express yourself. You need it like oxygen. Also feel free to PM me if it's getting too much for you, my friend. I'll also PM my email to you. Don;t let the bastards grind you down.
     
  15. LordManHammer

    LordManHammerMember Forum Member


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    Holy shit! what a fucked situation that is.

    I remember I was at a Anti War Rally in Philly for the Iraq war in 2002. I had the Geto Boys Fuck a War blasting on repeat and several people were bummed on me playing that as a form of protest as my voice was being drowned out possibly the music as well.

    I happened to also run into a friend whom had food from a less then reputable fast food chain, yeah I ate it as I was starving, but the looks of disgust from others when I was at the protest it just seemed like the higher the body count the lower the IQ was to talk shit about what I'm eating?! who gives a shit!
     
  16. The Hat

    The HatExperienced Member Experienced member


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    Thank you for your kind words of encouragement. I know I'll get through this, but, as you said, I'm still going through the grieving process.

    Unfortunately, I don't think that many people in the U.S. know that "Nonce" means Paedophile, so I don't think I can prove slander. And since this was said verbally, I'm not sure I have any case, nor would anybody want to represent me or hear it in a court of law. I do appreciate the suggestion, but I feel that the burden of proof would be on me. I think it's best to stay silent and be thought of as a fool, than to open my mouth and remove all doubt. Many is the time I wanted to use my mother's Facebook account and speak my mind on the bar's page, but I believe only chumps get on line and say things on the internet without the courage and conviction of saying it to their faces. It's like throwing a rock at somebody and running away instead of following through with your actions and taking responsibility. Idon't want to sound all hippy dippy but I do believe in Karma, and what goes around, eventually comes around. Their come uppance will arrive soon enough. I just have to be patient, as I'm sure I will eventually have the last laugh.

    I have found a few venues that hold open mikes that tolerate what I do. The big obstacle is getting myself motivated to go to them. I practice all the time, but, more often than not, I end up staying home. I know of one this Sunday where I've been once, and they seemed to like me there, so maybe I'll get to that. There's also one on Thursdays much closer to where I live, and I know the venue owner personally, as well as the host of the open mike, so I try my best to get to that on my better days when I'm feeling motivated.

    Once again, thanks for your support and kind words of encouragement. I hope the fires aren't getting any closer, and if they are, I wish you and your loved ones a safe passage.
     
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  17. 1xAntifa

    1xAntifaExperienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    OK. You're right mot to troll their FB page, especially using your mum's account. They will get their just deserts. The Thursday gig sounds like a good place to start.

    As far as the fires go, it has been a stressful day, especially watching towns I've lived in or visited going up in smoke. The roads out of here were blocked in both directions, but the escape route to Melbourne re-opened last night. Our town has become an evac centre for people nearby who have fled the fires. We're expecting a cooler day tomorrow with the chance of some light rain, which will help clearing the smoke haze. Unfortunately we can expect another severe day next week. The government has called in the army reserve to help and is opening military bases as evac centres. We live quite close to one in Bandiana, so if worse comes to worse we can bail out there if the roads get blocked again. Best we can do at the moment is sit tight, stay out of the smoke. watch the emergency services web page and the news and be ready to scarper at a moments notice.
     
  18. aint ashamed

    aint ashamedExperienced Member Experienced member


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    It's not that difficult to figure out if so called free speech is being used
    for recruitment, and, or hate influence. This constitutes a threat, plain
    and simple! I am proud to say, I'm a lover of all humanity, and a
    revolutionary of equal measure, and will be directed accordingly. aint ashamed
     

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