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Education on an anarchist society

Discussion in 'General political debates' started by antitude420, May 26, 2010.

  1. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    To me education and school are extremely important for a child and a teenager, it helps them understand the world around them but, at the same time, there are many subjects which are given less importance (like Anarchy in Philosophy) maybe because it's better for "the system" to have teens learning more about "social liberalism" and the "deontological ethics" and "social contracts" and all that kind of things which seems like the government trying to impose their failed ideologies to kids...

    If education as we know it would exist on an anarchist society, how would we decide what stuff to teach children without necessarily imposing something to everyone?
     

  2. Rathryn

    RathrynExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oct 21, 2009
     
    There have actually been several trials with schools who offer children the choice as to WHAT they want to learn.
    For me, basic education wouldn't differ much (math, language, foreign language [which is already mandatory here], art, etc), however starting from the age of 13ish, when kids around here go to secondary school (or high school, or grammar school, or whatever you want to call it) they should have a chance to not only explore new areas of knowledge, but themselves as well.
    I think that we need to start teaching our kids the most valuable skill of all, starting today: to think for themselves and look critically at the world.
     
  3. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Well, here our education system works as follow (well, I'm in an especialized art school, there are only two in the country so it's a bit different but it's the one I know) :

    We enter the 1st grade of primary/elementary school, on average, with 6 years old then primary school ends on 4th grade (10/11yo) and on 5th grade, basic/middle school starts and lasts until the 9th (14 yo) grade, at the end of which, we have to do two global exams (native language and math) which will determinate wheter we will pass to high school (16yo).
    Now, if you do pass, you get to choose an area to take until the end of high school (12th grade), I chose arts and, in my school, we have Portuguese (native language), English (foreign), Drawing, Physical Education (P.E), Philosophy and the one subject that makes our art school differ from all the other ones is Project and Technology. There, on 10th grade, we get a "taste" of all the areas we may chose on 11th grade, we have to make a project in context with that area, like, for example, when we were learning about Audiovisual Communication, the technologies we had to use were Cinema and Photography, on Cinema you had to do a short film, complete with a storyline, sketches of the scene, a summary of the whole short and then we had to record it and edit it, on photography we learned how to do pinholes cameras, we took some random photos and then manually printed them.
    You do that with every area throughout 10th grade (there are like 4 areas) and when 10th year is over, you get to choose one of the areas and then on that same subject (Project and Technologies), on 11th grade and, again on Audiovisual Communication (just because I'm more familiar with it), you'll have to choose an especific technology to learn on the final year, you get to choose three technologies : Video, Photography and 3D Design.
    Then once you especialize on one of those on 12th grade, and to determine your marks to go to college, you have to do a presentation about a topic, which is the same to everyone in every area in the school, and you'll be evaluated by a group of teachers and seen by a dozens of people and you'll also have to do a project for a real company and they'll evaluate your work too.

    It's kinda different in normal high schools, but I feel more comfortable talking about things I'm familiar with.

    I don't know if this was what you were talking about when you said children got to choose what they wanted to learn but if it was, I still have the feeling that our school program as a lot of capitalist and governmental propaganda...
     
  4. Rathryn

    RathrynExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oct 21, 2009
     
    You probably will not get rid of that propaganda, until you get rid of the source of said propaganda.
    But some people here actually took it a step further, they gave the children (age 4-13) the options of when to learn maths, when to learn Dutch (mother tongue here), when to do this or that, basically.
    Needless to say that a lot of schools basically did NOT attain the level required by government standards (one of the few GOOD government regulations in my opinion).
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montessori_method <-- that's one of the ideas used.
     
  5. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    Didn't read it all the way through but it seemed like a great method but I understand why many of the schools couldn't match the government standards.
    Maybe because government standards were made in context of the most globalized and "normal" learning methods, not the Montessori method, it doesn't mean it's not a good method, just one who doesn't match government standards.

    But, what about on an anarchist society? Will we apply the Montessori Method too and who would be the teachers? Volunteers maybe?
     
  6. Rathryn

    RathrynExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oct 21, 2009
     
    Teaching can theoretically done by anyone, what most people do NOT realise however is that teaching is a skill. A skill you need to learn and maintain. Montessori and similar methods basically relay that skill to children, who do NOT even have the basic skill sets. I think this is a shortcoming in that particular method. Though I see no problem with it once they've gained the basic skill sets.
    I do agree that the government standard only applies to the common denominator, however isn't it a good thing that there is a MINIMUM standard of knowledge maintained within a community or group?
    As for WHO would teach, like I said, anyone with the appropriate teaching skill. There should be a consensus within the community as to WHO would be allowed to teach the children and it would be up to the community to keep an eye on WHAT they are taught and HOW.
     
  7. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    Yea, I think it's great to have a minnimum standard of knowledge, I just think that it should be less linear and give chance to methods like the Montessori one.

    Still, even if the school subjects were to be choosen by the community itself, wouldn't it still be forcing our ideas down children's throats? It's a bit like what the government already does...
     
  8. Rathryn

    RathrynExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oct 21, 2009
     
    The difference would be in the 'secondary' subjects: critical thinking and assessment of self.
    Also some things are immutable, basically. Gravity will have a certain effect on things, fire will need fuel + oxygen + heat, 1+1 will be 2, etc.
    These are facts, I think it's important to grasp these basic concepts and even though kids will NOT like to have it 'forced down their throats', they are things they should know, in my opinion.
     
  9. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    I just find it hard to know whether is it legitimate or not to condradict ourselves and be authoritarians for the good of the community :/
     
  10. Rathryn

    RathrynExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Oct 21, 2009
     
    Good point, yet I see no other solution at the moment. 'Tis the only one I have, perhaps someone else could offer me an alternative. Besides it's a good point for me to take a step back and someone else join in on this discussion :p
     
  11. ungovernable

    ungovernableAutonome Staff Member Admin Team Experienced member


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  12. antitude420

    antitude420Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    May 16, 2010
     
    Thanks for the link, Ungovernable, I wasn't familiar with the concept of "free-school". That, imo, is probably the one concept which would fit better in any anarchist society (I loved the whole philosophy behind Summerhill School!).

    About Ferrer's, "Modern Schools", well, it's a bit what me and Rathryn were discussing... It'd still be imposing your believes on children, so I'm much more keen of the whole free-school concept.
     
  13. snookams

    snookamsExperienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Feb 7, 2010
     
    school experience in california is hell. i'm in orange county, and schools are underfunded and the kids learn nothing. if it wasn't for music with a message and literature and whatnot, i'd be a fucking moron (though that is still debatable, i'm sure).

    essentially, from kindergarden to senior year of high school, you're put into packed rooms with lots of screaming kids and the teachers and administration focus on discipline and standards more than actual education. most kids who drop out, take an excessive amount of drugs, or just quit school in general: all the while the school authorities are telling them what they're doing wrong and telling them that it's never enough, etc. for those students who do well in school, it's all about the money. they want to become doctors, actors, engineers, etc. to make money, not necessarily better mankind. and those that want to better mankind think the only way to do that is trust police and increase conservative fiscal economic policies. so many kids who have more anarchicst type beliefs drop out because of the sheer hopelessness and inafectiveness of Orange County's school system. thank odin i'm in college now and actually learning something, but even this is costing me an arm and a leg. alright....done complaining
     
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