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Dumbass excuses

Discussion in 'General political debates' started by Anom, Feb 19, 2010.

  1. NGNM85

    NGNM85 Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Sep 8, 2009
     
    When I finally see the light and glory of your beloved sinkhole of nihilism, you can say; "I told you so." However, you might not want to hold your breath. I am in no way convinced you have any valuable insight to offer, except perhaps, on mathematics. Especially after your decidedly underwhelming performance on the Elections thread. As you're a nihilist and thus you don't (or "can't") actually espouse 'animal rights' ideology, there is nothing more to say, really.
     
  2. NGNM85

    NGNM85 Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    I've already addressed the 'animal rights' thing, but I wanted to address this statement.
    I should say I DO have around 14 years or so of experience in the punk scene. I'm unaware of the rules, or what the limit is, but it certainly isn't new to me. Although, personally, I consider those years and experiences to be the least of my credentials. They might be important to me, but that's immaterial.
    How would you go about understanding anything? How would you go about understanding the third reich, or Edwardian England? You start with a very basic, and simplistic definition, then you do research. Preferably from multiple sources, and also from the authors with the best credentials. On a long enough time frame knowledge will follow. This is the standard approach. The texts I most recommend on the subject WERE written by the most unimpeachable sources, and are essentially considered the best journalism on the subject. However, I've read dozens of lesser texts.
     
  3. dwtcos

    dwtcos Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    punkmar, just a question. If you don't form your opinions out of a composite of things others have written or were reported to have said or your own experiences and background knowledge, then where in the world are you getting them from? I sometimes wished I had the ability to create entirely new ideas and opinions with absolutely no basis from the past. But as far as I know, that's impossible q:
     
  4. punkmar77

    punkmar77 Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    I understand your position on having had to learn things from the examples of the most accepted scholars however that in and of itself does not make you or I an 'expert'. I wouldn't consider myself to know more about the third reich (even if I earned a doctorate from Oxford on the subject) than some of the holocaust survivors that I've had the good fortune to befriend. This is what I find so frustrating about any of your postings, your mind isn't open to the experiences of others. You'd rather quote some "unimpeachable text" than seek out experiences and learn first hand and derive truth from a mixture of written, oral, and lived history. You constantly say that your not here to make friends and that it's not a popularity contest...which implies that the rest of us that don't agree with you are, well you might actually learn a lot by befriending others of your beloved Human Race and listening to what they have to say without being judgemental for once. I'm not saying agree with everyone, that would be rediculous, I'm saying if you are interested in being a teacher you have to open your mind much more than you do.
     
  5. punkmar77

    punkmar77 Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    I hope my last post clarifies how I feel about being an "authority on any subject"
     
  6. ASA

    ASA Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Nov 2, 2009
     
    sorry but theres a dumbass excuse, word to punkmar bla
     
  7. Ivanovich

    Ivanovich Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Is that a smoke screen, or what? Anyway, mathematics and computing, but no, probably not, that was a long time ago. I dunno, I think you missed the target again, but don't let that put you off. I just fucking with you really, which is a bit naughty, but wtf, you ask for it. Yes, I could present 'animal rights' ideology, both that of others (main points), and my own (in great detail), but I don't really see the point unless you open your mind, just a little, though of course, if you did that, you would be able to work most of it out on your own. Look, over there... It's that way, quick, before it runs away, again.
     
  8. Ivanovich

    Ivanovich Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Yeah, don't watch the game, play it. It's the only way you learn anything worthwhile.
     
  9. NGNM85

    NGNM85 Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    That's sort of how I think one would define "expert." So, I think that's an impasse.

    Ehh.. I'd agree with about 50% of that. Obviously, the experience of living under an oppressive dictatorship, or in a concentration camp, etc., cannot be fully appreciated simply by reading about it. This is true of many things. I could write a book about the experience of taking an acid trip and something would still get lost in translation. There is an ineffable quality to experience that cannot be expressed in words. The fundamental issue is what knowledge is being sought and for what purpose. I may not be able to understand the experience of Auschwitz, (Enough to know it was really fucking bad.) but by reading the books I've read I gain a clearer picture of the events in context. Personal recollections can be fragmented, or limited, or mistaken, it really primarily gives you insight into that specific person. If we want to understand a time period or a social movement, we need to take testimony from a number of individuals and then place that in context. Also, historians can be more objective. The books I most recommend on the subject of punk rock were written by people who were al there, Legs McNeil, Marc Spitz, Jon Savage, but they also go beyond their own personal experiences and place events in a broader context. This is why I don't mention my years of being in the punk scene because that only applies to events I participated in and therefore doesn't really qualify me to speak about punk rock as a whole, or the evolution of punk rock.

    See above.

    Not necessarily. I was just pointing out that a lot of the criticism had a lot less to do with my ideas and a lot more to do with disparaging my character. Even if it's true, the assertion that I'm a bastard isn't intellectually interesting and doesn't contribute much to the debate. It's like when people just say, y'know, 'You're wrong." How can I possibly accept that statement without substantiation? It's useless.

    I don't think it's possible to not make judgements. However, prejudices are another matter. Everybody has them, I try to be pretty vigorous in keeping that tendency in check, personally. As far as the subjects at hand, to quote the comedian Bill Maher; "I'm not pre-judging, I'm judging." There may be two sides to every story, but only one truth. That's very important to keep in mind.
     
  10. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69 Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    i folded my homework into a paper airplane, and it was hijacked and crashed into the world trade center. that's my dumbass excuse for the day :lmao:
     
  11. ASA

    ASA Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Nov 2, 2009
     
    germs you are showing worrying attributes, its all about U
     
  12. NGNM85

    NGNM85 Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    I want to elaborate on my response to this statement. What I see as an alarming tendency in 'radical' circles is a sort of 'groupthink.' I observe individuals expressing opinions or ideas simply because they are, or are seen to be, reflecting the 'general wisdom.' I think a lot of the talk surrounding animal rights reflects a lot of this, so does the compulsive branding of anything and everything as "sellouts", but there are lots of other examples. I'm for more thought and rational reflection on these matters, on all matters, really. I do think that there is a tendency to simply go along with the crowd and that's something that needs to be addressed.
     
  13. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69 Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    it's funny because i don't see many examples of that. I see most people here being able to speak for themselves, and not being afraid to say something unpopular or that they know others will agree with. After all, that all goes in hand with anarchism, not accepting the plan and ideas others lay out for you...
     
  14. punkmar77

    punkmar77 Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member


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    Are you 'Radical' NGNM85?
     
  15. NGNM85

    NGNM85 Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Try endorsing ideas that don’t fit with the ‘general wisdom’ and see what happens. I’m obviously not afraid to take unpopular positions and can attest to the results.


    It depends. This is one of those instances where language sort of becomes an impediment to communication. In terms of the prevailing attitudes or the ‘general wisdom’, most definitely. However, I would consider many of my ideas to be pretty much common sense. On the issue of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict, for example, I generally support the findings of the international court, and the position of the United Nations and the Arab League, essentially a global consensus, but in the US that’s called ‘radical.’
     
  16. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69 Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    you mean like how i said i believe in god and took a verbal beating from almost every member on this board who read it? Yeah i know nothing about posting unpopular viewpoints...
     
  17. NGNM85

    NGNM85 Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    .....You could make a comparison. I don't see how anyone, especially an Anarchist can take that position, but it's certainly against the grain. However, I'm not against disagreement and debate, what I am against is people jumping on bandwagons or merely regurgitating the 'party line' or whatever without thinking about it.
     
  18. Anxiety69

    Anxiety69 Experienced Member Uploader Experienced member Forum Member


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    i understand what you are saying, but you shouldn't be feeling like you are carrying this burden alone. I mean, look at how many members have come and gone from this board, and how quickly as well... i like to think those of us who have stuck around here fro a while are the ones who aren't the band wagon jumpers, and feel like being here is significant. even if we tend to argue a lot... but through arguments come decisions, and through decisions comes the possibility of action...
     
  19. ASA

    ASA Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Nov 2, 2009
     
    whats is your position, you believe in god but don't go to church, mosque, temple etc?

    mine is your're from america, the other is 'gods' a myth, it is merely hope but like anything taken too far as many do when its fundamental kills many in its 'names sake', oh and can you please keep it succint, cheers

    also, do u believe in evolution? if i've forgotten, soz
     
  20. Anom

    Anom Experienced Member Experienced member Forum Member


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    Dec 21, 2009
     
    I've met a bunch of people in diferent kinds of groups that do just jump on the bandwagon, as you express it. However, i never was one of those. I've left some organisations because of it, when it has seemed everyone else are just agreeing for the sake of agreeing, and i've always formed my own oppinions instead of just accepting the popular view on things. For that i've gotten in lots of less then pleassurable situations but i say it as i see it and i don't accept an idea to be truth if i haven't my self commen to the same conclusion, after giving it lots and lots of thought. I don't have a need though, to disagree with everyone all the time eighter, just to not seem like someone who agrees, if you know what i mean. On here i believe most of us are taking the time and effort to think and form her/his/what-ever-you-want-to-be-called's ideas.
     
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