on calling cops pigs

(Semi) Relevant photo's are the bee's knees.
I understand your idea on leather, but I don't think (if you have proof otherwise please show me, I'm actually interested in this) all leather comes from cattle that were already murdered in the meat industry.

Also, pissing against the wind only gets your piss all over yourself.
Teach more people they don't need to consume as capitalism provides will only (slowly) bring down capitalism.
It's worth the effort isn't it?

 

Sorry, old pal, but :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lemming
Lemmings became the subject of a popular myth that they commit mass suicide when they migrate. Driven by strong biological urges, some species of lemmings may migrate in large groups when population density becomes too great. Lemmings can swim and may choose to cross a body of water in search of a new habitat. In such cases, many may drown if the body of water is so wide as to stretch their physical capability to the limit. This fact combined with the unexplained fluctuations in the population of Norwegian lemmings gave rise to the myth.
The myth of lemming "mass suicide" is long-standing and has been popularized by a number of factors. In 1955, Disney Studio illustrator Carl Barks drew an Uncle Scrooge adventure comic with the title "The Lemming with the Locket". This comic, which was inspired by a 1954 American Mercury article, showed massive numbers of lemmings jumping over Norwegian cliffs. Even more influential was the 1958 Disney film White Wilderness, which won an Academy Award for Documentary Feature, in which staged footage was shown with lemmings jumping into certain death after faked scenes of mass migration. A Canadian Broadcasting Corporation documentary, Cruel Camera, found that the lemmings used for White Wilderness were flown from Hudson Bay to Calgary, Alberta, Canada, where they did not jump off the cliff, but were in fact launched off the cliff using a turntable.

 

So what about the chemical pollution produced to produce synthetic materials, or capitalisms tendency to "optimize" ways of production in agriculture too - ending up with "vegan"-winterboots causing skinirritations because of the contamination with herbizides? (Actual a big scandal around here)
Besides the speciesism-question it isn't that easy as long as the economical system prevents any change, so I agree about "pissing in the wind".
I still wear leathers and NPS-boots, both for years and I honor the remembrance of the skins original wearers with regular product-care, so I guess I don't need new ones in this lifetime.

 

Absolutely agreed on the sequence of importance, don't get me wrong, I never doubt the urgency of the issue, or the necessity to fight the complex struggle to accoplish the change, for me it's a fight for survival.
Because of this, I would also agree that the future of mankind after the liberation is at least vegetarian, because it will be more effective and enviroment protecting to feed the worlds population on veggie-diet instead of wasting resources for meat production, I thing someone brought up this argument in a previous post too.
Following the buddhist saying "the cage of another is my cage too" there is a point in anti-speciesism, but because of the evidence provided by evolution theory and our species' rise from omnivore apes to the top of the food chain, I still can't see the absolute urgency of your belief.

 

suggesting youre going to eat a beef sandwich is a perfect sign of your guilt. ive heard that SO many times.
informing people of what exactly?

i really cant be assed to go back to find your question, so please ask it again and i will answer it.

 

why do you think its stupid to be concerned about how people view animals? thats what this is all about.
how is being vegan, politics?

 

there is a MASSIVE difference to cats eating mice etc. humans farm animals, they force them to breed. if you were trying to argue animal eating by hunting a wild deer, then this would be a different discussion, but youre not, youre trying to argue how its ok for big business to breed animals soley for profit, so you can eat your burger. animal agriculture is BIG business. im guessing that doesnt concern you?

by refusing animal flesh i am making a difference. by saying im not racist, im making no difference.

 

oh dear! for someone who claims to be vegetarian for 5 years, you seem a bit, lacking in knowledge of what a vegetarian is.
the idea of fake meats is to show the people who want to eat without guillt that there is an alternative.
if animals ARE tasty, why do people cover them in bbq sauce? why do they feel they need to cook them?

do you really feel that threatened that you think im "ramming" it down your throat? are you really a vegetarian? you argue just like a meat eater! if you really feel concerned that im ramming it down your throat (nobody has ever told me what that actually means) you really have got a shock when you get out into the big world fighting your governments.

wait? you say you have no problem with people hunting their "meat" if the populations are sustainable, yet you have no problem with people eating farmed animals? meat and dairy consumption is the single biggest contributor to greenhouse gasses. the dairy industry is the biggest cause of pollution to streams and rivers. sustainable? i think not.

being an anarchist wont change the world. but you know thats not what its about,its about making progress however big.
what wil lall the government employees do when theres no governments?
dude, you seriously need to think about your arguments.

 

the meat industry would fall apart if it couldnt sell the animal skins (leather).
animal agriculture IS capitalism. people here have fallen for it, falsely believing that NEED to eat animals.

 

You can't seriously make a blanket statement and include everyone here, what is it that makes people come on to this forum and start lecturing everyone as if you're talking to uneducated children? This is what we mean by coming and ramming your views down peoples throats. Many of us here are activists and have extensive knowledge of everything you are citing as far as statistics, and I personally agree with 99% of what you and howgodskill are talking about, BUT the condescending attitude is so ridiculously off putting that you will drive people away from your causes with sheer single-minded and relentless rhetoric. So because people don't agree with your assessment of the correlation between animal rights and not calling cops pigs they are fake anarchists? Wow....

 

i didnt say "everyone here..." did i? i said "people here".
how is me telling people what veganism all about ramming down throats, yet people here going on about conspircay theory nullshit not ramming down throats, how is there a difference?
and you really think that someone who is starting to feel guilt about eating meat, is not going to go vegetarian because they think im a twat? do you really think people are that dumb, that theyd be that easily put off their own compassion?

how do you expect people to react to "im gonna go have a big beef sandwich? how do you expect people to react to the crassness of statements like that?
you either feel its important or you dont.

 

sorry, missed this bit. thanks for YOUR condescending "shut up" remark.
where did i say that?
nobody here is an anarchist, they may be striving for anarchism, but they are not anarchists.

 

I would expect you to realize he's baiting you and laugh it off, because it's obvious that he said that just to yank your chain, don't lose your sense of humor or you will become the monsters you are looking to eliminate.

 

Ok point taken, and I didn't mean to put down the animal rights movement, i just get defensive when it's rammed down my throat, and to me it's not as important as other things, but that doesn't give me a right to demean it, just as I don't feel anyone has a right to demean me if i choose to eat meat. (and not that it's anyone's business but i was a vegetarian for 7 years, and it wasn't for me, but i don't make fun of or insult vegetarians or vegans (well maybe the raw foods ones j/k) and I expect the same treatment towards myself. I am well aware of the horrors of the meat industry, but frankly i am more concerned with other things at this point in my life.

 

of course i know hes trying to bait me, and thats through his own guilt, why would he bother otherwise?
if me pointing out his guilt means you thinking im ramming down throats, whatever, i thought people here would be adult enough to go off crying that someone is "ramming down...." blah blah.

 

Fine since you can't be bothered to answer my questions, expect the same treatment from me, and again, no guilt at all towards my diet. Assume all you want but remember the old cliche about assuming. I don't judge you for your diet so leave me alone.

Way to make a blanket judgement when you don't know anyone here.

Well said. You have been disrespectful to me so i found a sore spot with you and am exploiting it. yes it's juvenile, and it wasn't my intention to begin with, and now that i'm aware of it i'll try not to do it, but it doesn't change that you are being awfully cocky and arrogant.

 

you were obviously vegetarian for the wrong reasons if you came to the conclusion it "wasnt for me".
thats the typical selfishness of animal eaters.
im not vegan for me, id love to be able to just eat what the fuck i want, when i want, but thats not something i can do knowing the immense pain, suffering and misery that goes with a burger and milkshake.
what other things are you more concerned about? why is it so hard to pick up a veggie burger instead of a beef burger, what stops you doing that? ill answer my own question, laziness.

 

i have said ,please ask me the question again if its that important to you, if its not, stop going on about it.

its not a case of leaving YOU alone, its not about you, its about animals being pointlessly eaten by people who fall for the propaganda of having to eat animals. its about animals not having to be subjected to slaughterhouses, smelling death, hearing death.

a blanket statement? well it depends on your take of anarchy. for me, it wouldnt involve upholding capitalism which is what all of us here are doing.